Stopper **ACTUALLY** has a point, sort of. In a vacuum, looking at stats, Taylor is just about perfectly in the middle of the pack in terms of Total QBR and Rating. 15th in terms of Rating, 14th in terms of tQBR. There were also only 13 QBs with a PTS ADDED of greater than or equal to 10, of which he was 12th. Players ahead of Taylor in QBR that I personally wouldn't take over him are Dak Prescott and Case Keenum. Granted, we have Tyrod on a 1 year deal, but if with the caveat that if he makes like a pervert and balls out this year, they could franchise him..so considering that, I would take into account aged players that were in the top of the league that I wouldn't risk it on (let's be honest, older bones might not hold up to all the hits he could take and he was sacked 3rd most last year, 15x above average), that would exclude Brady, Rivers, Brees, that puts him upto 7th. That leaves Wentz, Ryan, Smith, Roethlisberer, Stafford and WIlson. Ryan and Stafford have put up good numbers, Matty Ice has been inconsistent, especially considering the weapons he has had (arguably on par with the Browns potential this year), and Stafford may be able to throw the ball through a brick wall but has demonstrated continual poor decision making and has had a knock on him for not being a real leader. Using Rating, as mentioned he was 15th. Players ahead of him that I wouldn't want over him (factoring age), Keenum, McCown, Winston, Dalton (tied), Brees, Brady, Rivers, and really on the fence about Cousins. Kirk puts up stats but hasn't really put his (albeit dysfunctional) teams over the top. That puts him into the top 10. Rating places him above Botles, Carr, Prescott, Newton, Manning, Flacco, Mariota, Trubisky, and of course, Kizer. I know someone is going to grab the line of me saying I wouldn't want Brady, Brees, etc. However, that is based this year in the specific situation with the question marks at both tackle positions, with his age, with the thought of keeping him for a year (probably as an asset). I would absolutely LOVE to have Wentz on THIS team. However, drafting him wouldn't have made this team possibly. Also, with Hue running the show, the offense wouldn't have been tailored to his strengths the way it is in Philly, and he would end up just another bum that Cleveland wasted a pick on.
I don't disagree with either of you, I just wanted to give him a chance to reach the best Browns QBs of our generation first...well, maybe not SAS, how old are you again, I seriously can't remember...You have to remember Bernie at least.
That happens once in a VERY great while...however...I see some holes in your theory. Even if, Tyrod gets put ahead of many of those names and places him around 6-8th...He is still an average QB every single year..The names may change ahead of him, but he has remained average. On the plus side...HE'S REMAINED AVERAGE. Not many QBs will stay as consistent as Tyrod Taylor has over his career thus far. That's an asset on a team that has only seen ONE "average" QB in two decades...that's ONE season, not one QB that have had average careers. In 2015 Josh McCown was ranked #14 in QB rating, even though he only played 8 games. So in reality, in two decades of football we have watched an average QB for a half of a single season.... Let me say this one more time- TYROD TAYLOR will be a huge asset to this 2018 team. Now, that said, average won't win Super Bowls without having a once in a life time defense. The hope is that Baker Mayfield is one of the top 5 QBs in the coming years. Again, not many rookies come close to average, even the great ones...so Tyrod is a Godsend for the 2018 season. If it's for a single season, in order for Baker to get ready, I would have been ok with anyone in this paragraph. The only one I would have taken in place of Baker, ironically since you are on the fence, is Cousins. Only because he has been consistent on shit teams and he has age on his side compared to the others. Having Cousins, Barkley and Ward would have given us immediate results, I believe...Baker will take another year to start producing, but in the long run, I think Baker will absolutely be the better QB, so Saquon aside, imho the right choice was made. One last thing we disagree on...Not that I don't like Wentz, but as you already alluded to, we wouldn't have this team without passing on him. THIS team still has to prove themselves worthy of praise..it's all on paper at this point. I also agree that without a coordinator, Wentz would have faltered under Hue..however, if it wasn't just talk, if they had given Hue Wentz, maybe he would have hired an OC sooner. He has maintained for two years, he didn't believe it fair that the offense wasn't ready for an OC. I personally think that is just back talk, but who knows... I prefer the current roster WITH Baker Mayfield, over: WHAT THE EAGLES GOT 2016 first-round pick (No. 2) The Eagles drafted Wentz with this pick. 2017 fourth-round pick (No. 139) The Eagles traded this pick to the Vikings to move up seven spots and draft running back Donnell Pumphrey. WHAT THE BROWNS GOT 2016 first-round pick (No. 8): Traded to Titans Browns drafted 2016 first-round pick (No. 15, Corey Coleman, WR) 2016 third-round pick (No. 76, Shon Coleman, OL) 2017 second-round pick (No. 52, DeShone Kizer, QB) Titans drafted 2016 first-round pick (No. 8, Jack Conklin, OL) 2016 sixth-round pick (No. 176, Andy Janovich, FB) 2016 third round (No. 77): Traded to Panthers Browns drafted 2016 third-round pick (No. 93, Cody Kessler, QB) 2016 fourth-round pick (No. 129, Derrick Kindred, S) 2016 fifth-round pick (No. 168, Spencer Drango, OL) Panthers drafted 2016 third-round pick (No. 77, Daryl Worley, CB) 2016 fifth-round pick (No. 141, Zack Sanchez, CB) 2016 fourth-round pick (No. 100): Traded to Raiders Browns drafted 2016 fourth-round pick (No. 114, Ricardo Louis, WR) 2016 fifth-round pick (No. 154, Jordan Payton, WR) Raiders drafted 2016 fourth-round pick (No. 100, Connor Cook, QB) 2017 first-round pick (No. 12): Traded to Texans Browns drafted 2017 first-round pick (No. 25, Jabrill Peppers, S) 2018 first-round pick (No. 4, Denzel Ward, CB) Texans drafted 2017 first-round pick (No. 12, Deshaun Watson) 2018 second-round pick (No. 64): Traded to the Colts Browns drafted 2018 third-round pick (No. 67, Chad Thomas, DE) 2018 sixth-round pick (No. 178, traded to the Patriots for No. 105, Antonio Callaway, WR) Colts drafted 2018 third-round pick (No. 64, Tyquan Lewis, DE) So from the ashes of that trade come potential starters in: Corey Coleman (last chance to stay healthy for a whole season and contribute) Shon Coleman, we will find out soon enough if he is worthy of replacing a HOFer Jabrill Peppers, out of necessity, misused in 2017...we will soon see at SS Denzel Ward, looks the part, the rookie could shine sooner than later Valuable backups/starters in the past already: Cody Kessler, gave us a year of his career which could have broken him given the situation...moved on, but he did contribute Derrick Kindred, remains a valuable piece to this defense. Started all last year, played pretty well, only Peppers removes him from starting Spencer Drango, stepped into a HOFers shoes to finish out a dreadful season and actually held his own. His shortcomings as a LT were evident, but at least he didn't get Kizer killed. Will be a valuable back up guard, with Bitonio's injury history. Ricardo Lewis, with the influx of talent brought in, he may be on the fence..but my guess is he will still be contributing in 2018. Chad Thomas and Antonio Callaway are anyone's guess..way too early to assume they may contribute in any way. But if ONE trade produces contributing starters in Denzel Ward, Julius Peppers and Shon Coleman..it will all be worth it if Baker also pans out....remember, if we take Wentz, we don't get Baker..that's the main story line here. Who will be the better QB 5 years from now, that is a measuring stick we will be watching.
Hey @showstopper! Here's a quote from Mr. Drew Brees who knows *way* more about football than me and *infinitely* more than you. Have a blessed day.
Didn't catch this segment, but here's one for you: http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/24045670/ranking-nfl-best-worst-offensive-arsenals-weapons-2018
This is the only major miss, in my opinion. The Browns got Corey Coleman, Shon Coleman, and DeShone Kizer for this deal. One is no longer with the team, one is going to struggle to make the final roster, and one is competing for a spot on the line. I would happily give back the Colemans (and you know my thoughts on Kizer) to have just one Jack Conklin on the team.
I don't disagree with that. The players are where they missed. The deal was a good one, when they were looking for a project JT replacement down the line, not a starting LT. If they had stayed at #8, the pick probably isn't Jack Conklin. It might have been Eli Apple or Vernon Hargreaves, either of which would also have been an improvement, but not as big as Conklin...and it might have kept us from drafting Ward, which would NOT have been an improvement...see how every move effects the other.
That’s funny go rehash my posts on Conklin...calling him the best OL in the draft and saying he would be All Pro
First of all, I understand the situation in Cleveland. As brutal as the last couple decades have been for the Browns, I'm never miserable during football season. I'm a fan of the entire game. High School, NCAA, NFL...Football is my passion in life. Do the Browns frustrate me at times? Of course.. Sure it's more fun when my team is competitive, but I love football, and I find a way to stay entertained even when my team isn't.... Second, don't talk to me about what my goals are. You haven't a clue... It's called being a fan. Yes, I'm optimistic every year that things will get better. This year, call me crazy, but it feels they really got it going in the right direction. Players are chirping about an entirely new feel within the building. The fans can feel it too.... If I thought like you, I wouldn't even care for the sport. Talk about miserable. You dwell in that world and spend all your time trying to drag everyone else down with ya. It's as predictable as anything in life, but still sad and pathetic none the less...So go ahead and try to spin this. Everyone can see right through you anyway...
^^^^^ You did make "Alex Mack isn't a good center" a hill you wanted to die on, though: You had (have?) an unsual fascination with Pouncy - who I've routinely denigrated as "not good". To wit: And only Travis Fredrick (DAL) has been better over the past five seasons:
That's not what he was saying. Showstopper is made out to be a punching bag around here, but when the guy gets things right, he should be given credit. I don't expect you to give it to him, but for everyone else: Showstopper was saying that, rather than pegging hopes of a savior and penultimate QB on Mayfield, let's let him win the starting QB job, first. You know, one step at a time. I know it sounds crazy...
