Today I read that Joe Haden is on the trade block! OH NO! I like the smell of burnt toast on Sundays! If this happens A.J. Green will be highly disappointed,lol Haden is helping him become a H.O.F. THE BROWNS ARE TRYING TO GET THAT 1st PICK! They have a lot of holes to fill. Going to trade that pick for multiple picks. Maybe today they filled 1 with Collins! The bad thing is all these young guys I wanted to see play and grow are out. Well Coleman is suppose to come back this week. GOOOO TRIBE!!!! win one for the GIPPER!!!!!
I didnt expect this team to win very many games, 2/3 tops. I just didn't think they would not have a win this late into the season. I know this is going to be a 3/4 year rebuild if they do it right. That's why I say shop JT. He will be 34/35 at that time. He deserve to be on a winner. Plus the Browns could get another 1st rd pick for him. Same goes with Joe "OVER RATED, OVER PAID" Haden. You wont get a 1st rd pick for Haden. Ive heard a 3rd rd pick. Thats OK though. Dump that high arse salary.
Everyone needs to stop with the "we should trade Joe Thomas because he deserves better" angle....JOE IS HAPPY TO BE A CLEVELAND BROWN!!!!!! WHY IS THAT SO PHUQUIN HARD FOR PEOPLE TO ACCEPT???? It like Irish mentioned. None of the "experts" know WTH they are talking about...Everbody and their brother had us having the fire sale, and "Moneyball" just goes out and gets us an ALL PRO LB...lol!
WHY did Haslam go outside the box and hire an entire front office of NON FOOTBALL MEN TO RUN HIS FOOTBALL TEAM? Brown and Padesta are NUMBERS GUYS!!!!! THEY ARE NUMBERS GUYS!!! another question? WHY DID THESE NUMBERS GUYS CUT ALL OFF THE VETERAN LEADERSHIP ON THIS TEAM? Except Joe Thomas? Because with all those high priced and over paid vets his team was still bad. Gilbert was a high draft pick who was terrible. SO THEY TRADED HIS CONTRACT! ERVING WILL BE NEXT! They are going to get rid of his contract! NOW! This team is 0 and whatever. Joe Thomas makes a chit load of money. They have NO F%$^%$# wins with him. THEY HAVE WENT THROUGH 5 QBS WITH HIM, HE IS 31 YEARS OLD AND MAKES A CHIT LOAD MONEY. Unlike Gilbert they can unload his contract and receive a 1st rd pick for him! Picks are what they are after. THEY ARE CHEAPER! The money ball guys are here to save Haslam money on payroll! WAKE UP CLEVELAND! Haslam told us all he is not spending a bzillion dollars in free agency. WHY? PEOPLE WHY? THIS TEAM IS GOING TO BUILD THROUGH THE DRAFT AND SAVE HASLAM MONEY IN PAYROLL IN THE PROCESS! THEY ARE A 3 WIN TEAM WITH A HIGH, AGEING PAYROLL. SO HE CUT THEM. HE IS TRADING PLAYERS THAT DON'T PLAY UP TO THE MONEY THEY MAKE! JOE HADEN IS ONE OF THEM and IS ON THE BLOCK! Another question. IS HADEN WORTH HIS CONTRACT? I THINK NOOOOOOOOO! It will be hard to trade Thomas. This fan base wont leave. They are selling out every game still. JT & Haden are the only players that fits the bill of trading a huge contract that doesn't equate to wins! SO THEY CAN GET MORE PICKS AND SAVE HASLAM MORE MONEY! Get the blinders off. See the team for what it is. Young and rebuilding through the draft! To do that they need picks. Who is your highest trading chips? THOMAS AND HADEN!
How much money does that All-pro LB make? Didn't the Browns have 2 3rd rd picks. Could they draft a player that is as good as Collins with a 3rd rd pick? "MONEY BALL" Joe Thomas isn't the kind of guy to say "GET ME THE HELL OUT OF HERE" He has made his money. He deserves to win. He has played for the most dysfunctional franchise in sports history, maybe. The best thing he can do for this team is to be traded to a contender and let the Browns get that much needed 1st rd pick.
Oh boy. Are chill pills still available these days? Holy crap. After all that rant Els, it's like you are on both sides of the fence. lol! Who specifically has the "blinders on", and doesn't understand this is a rebuild?? You realize the "numbers guys", as you refer to them, have already acquired a ton of picks for the next two drafts, right? You bitch about our "numbers guys" letting the supposed team leaders out the door, and then in the next sentence you say they should get rid of Joe Thomas and Joe Haden... *DONT_KNOW* You really need to stop telling us all to "wake up", as if you have all the answers, especially if you are going to babble on like that...smh
How Collins Trade Fits Browns Plan Jared Mueller 7:03 PM In a surprise move, the Cleveland Browns acquired a player and traded a draft pick before Tuesday's deadline. As the NFL Trade Deadline came into view, most fans and analysts believed that the?Cleveland Browns?would be sellers. It made sense, the Browns?didn't bring back any of their big free agents, they didn't bring in much talent in free agency, they traded down in the draft, they traded?Andy Lee,?Barkevious Mingo?and?Justin Gilbert?and they were rumored to have everyone but?Terrelle Pryor?on the trading block. Then, all of a sudden, the Browns traded for?Jamie Collins?from the?New England Patriots. In the first year that compensatory picks can be traded, the Browns essentially dealt the pick they expect to get for losing?Alex Mack?for Collins, and the right to pay him. If, for some reason, the Browns don't get that pick in 2017, they will trade their 4th Rounder in 2018. So how does the trade fit? Assets! The Browns value assets, not draft picks. While we focus on draft picks and very young players as assets, a stud level linebacker who is about to be a free agent fits the bill. Collins is able to play a variety of positions and is the rare linebacker that can cover almost any position. He isn't the pass rusher of a?Von Miller?but his value goes far beyond that of the box score. Collins will primarily play inside next to either?Christian Kirksey?or?DeMario Davis. Kirksey is at his best in pass coverage while Davis' value is solely in run defense. Kirksey is more multi-dimensional than Davis so he shouldn't see a downturn in his playing time. Davis is far more likely to. By trading a late 3rd or early 4th Round pick for Collins now, the Browns have secured early negotiation rights for a player that could be the top free agent at the end of the year. They also traded for the right to Franchise Tag him if needed. There are few late 3rd Round picks that could come close to the value of Collins over the next 4 years. He will cost a pretty penny to keep him around but highly talented players are worth it. With the amount of cap space the Browns currently have, keeping Collins around for years should not be difficult. Pryor and Collins will need contracts this year but they can load up those contracts in the early years to still have money when?Joel Bitonio,?Isaiah Crowell?and Kirksey need new contracts thereafter. Worst case for the Browns, Collins leaves in Free Agency at the end of this year or next, after a Franchise Tag. This scenario brings back a 3rd Round Compensatory Pick for the team, just a year or two later.? Getting 8 to 24 games of Collins with the only cost being delaying when they get a pick, plus his contract, is the worst case scenario. Having a 26-year-old, stud linebacker who can play the run, cover and rush the passer a little bit, signed for years to come is the more expected scenario. This is the kind of player that you save cap space for. This is the kind of player that you gather draft assets to be able to get. This is the kind of player that you bring in to help change a culture. This is the kind of player that you use the assets you have gathered to trade in for. This is the kind of no lose move that it seems other teams often benefit from. It is nice to have the Browns be that team for once. Being a buyer at the NFL Trade Deadline is the opposite of what many expected but it fits who they are. They value assets, traded a middling one for a star, versatile player and have no downside to the trade. This is the kind of move the?Cleveland Browns Organization?want to be known for. Hue Jackson has said over and over again that he Expects to Win. The Front Office values assets. Trading for?Jamie Collins?fits both, and it is perfect.
Chill pills aren't gonna do it, TD. Hell, Els has been refusing to take his meds since the first loss in the preseason. SMH. The Alzheimers and Bi-polar ain't gonna cure themselves. *CRAZY*
Hey, when did we get the little Wahoo icon under our Av's? Thanks to whichever mod gave that to us. *DRINK*
One win to go with Game 6 tonight in Cleveland. They can win it all at home with the entire city celebrating inside and outside of the park. I feel like the Dad from Christmas Story when he got the telegram for his "major award" and started dancing around the living room. "Tonight, tonight tonight, it's coming tonight!, hot damn tonight!!!!!!!!!" Sorry about the crappy video quality but it's the only one on Youtube. [video]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DE2l5filkMU[/video]
I'm with TD and Duff...you are off your rocker... Joe Thomas DOES NOT WANT to go any where. He actually wants to be a part of the puzzle that gets this franchise going in the right direction...a puzzle that has many pieces...taking one away doesn't help form the picture, it makes it less likely that you will ever see it. As for Collins, at the moment he makes $485,929 for the remainder of 2016... Pretty simple here, they got one of the premier LBs in the NFL... What did they give up? A 3rd round COMPENSATORY draft pick that they will receive for Alex Mack (or if for some unforseen reason they don't get a 3rd for Mack, then the Patriots get their 4th rounder, and Mack would at the very least bring a comp 4th rounder). Now one of three things happen... (1)They re-sign Collins(and reports are he is ready and willing to sign a long term deal with Cleveland) which will be in the neighborhood of $14-15M per year and about $35M guaranteed, much of which can be front loaded due to the Browns salary cap situation after dropping so much money prior to this season. (2) They re-sign Terrell Pryor soon, leaving the franchise tag as a viable option. The Tag would only cost the Browns about $15M, which is the expected value of the contract money anyway, so one of these two options are the most likely to happen. (3) They cannot re-sign Pryor before free agency, they decide to sign Pryor to the franchise tag and cannot come up with a deal prior to free agency on Collins. If he makes it to the market, it is possible someone overpays him and the Browns lose him to free agency...IF THAT HAPPENS, the Browns will CERTAINLY receive a 3rd round compensatory pick in the 2018 draft. So worst case scenario, they picked up an All Pro LB to help this porous defense compete in 2016 for a measly $486K...Best case scenario, the just got a 26 year old All Pro LB for the next 5-6 years to have that piece on defense to build around.... Right now, if they sign him they have: Collins 26 (only singed through 2016/17) Nassib 23 (signed through 2019/20) Ogbah 22 (signed through 2019/20) Shelton 23 (signed through 2018/19) Davis 27 (signed through 2017/18) Not sure if I'd count him yet, but he is coming along in Christian Kirksey 24 (signed through 2017/18) They can concentrate on the deep draft class of defensive backfield in the 2017 draft. Adding Collins gives them a great base to build around...and they have decent backups at many positions, who are unfortunately right now being counted on as starters, main role players.
Except that they will also be the beneficiary of a comp pick if he leaves. So basically they traded a '17 comp pick for a '18 comp pick if he doesn't re-sign or they don't tag him.
And of course there's the possibility they aren't awarded a 3rd and they have to give NE a 2018 4th. And if Collins leaves in free agency it's a damn near certainty that would be for a 3rd round comp so the Browns would be moving up in the '18 draft for nothing. It's really a can't lose proposition for the Browns. Not sure about the MONEYBALL approach in Cleveland but if this is an example it looks pretty good.
Yeah, I jumped the gun on that beach and never went back and edited the post... I like this move all around.
Just wanted to add that Collins just turned 27 in October. Guy is in his prime and is worth another big 4-5 year contract if he chooses to re-sign with Cleveland. And you throw in the Comp Draft pick discussion points that Beach offered up and this is ABSOLUTELY a no-brainer.
NFL Network's Ian Rapoport reports Browns ILB Jamie Collins is looking for more than $12 million per season on his next deal. Luke Kuechly's $12.36 million AAV is the most among off-ball linebackers, and it sounds like Collins wants to beat that mark. Considering the Browns have a ton of cap space and will want to keep him after giving up a third-round pick, there is a decent chance he reaches that goal. Trading with the Patriots does not usually work out, but Collins has the talent to be a defensive building block for Cleveland.
CLEVELAND, Ohio ? When the first pitch of tonight's World Series Game 6 is thrown, the last surviving player on the Cleveland Indians' 1948 world championship team is set to be in attendance. Eddie Robinson, 95, the only living member of the 1948 team, has been invited to be a guest of the Indians in a Progressive Field suite as Cleveland takes on the Chicago Cubs with a 3-2 series lead. Robinson, a first baseman for the Indians in 1948, delivered the series-clinching RBI hit in the eighth inning of Game 6 off Warren Spahn of the Boston Braves.
BEREA, Ohio - Hue Jackson made it clear the winless Browns didn't trade for Pro Bowl linebacker Jamie Collins just to help them survive these last eight games. "No, I don't think we want to try him out,'' said Jackson. "We'd love to keep him, obviously. But it's got to be mutual. Hopefully we can move in that direction. I don't think we would've done this if we don't think there's an opportunity to move forward with him.'' That means the Browns have either already started extension talks or will soon for Collins, who's four-year rookie contract expires after this season. They acquired him Monday in a trade with New England for what will be a third-round compensatory pick in 2017. It's technically listed as a conditional fourth-rounder in 2018, but that will change once the Browns are awarded the third-rounder in March, based on their 2016 losses in free agency. The Browns intend to sign Collins to a long-term deal, but will still have to surrender the pick if they can't. If he walks after this season, they'll still get a compensatory pick for him in 2018. But Collins won't come cheap. According to ESPN's Adam Schefter, Collins was looking for "Von Miller money'' out of the Patriots, who were struggling to extend him. That's an average of about $19 million a year. The problem is, Collins, more of a coverage 'backer, has 10.5 sacks over the past 3.5 seasons, while Miller averages almost 14 sacks a season when healthy. It's also a far cry from the $485,928 Collins is making this season. "We added a tremendous football player to our team today,'' said Jackson. "It's another sign of where we're headed. We're (always) looking for ways to improve our team and we truly did so here today. He's going to come here with an open mind and come here and play football.'' The Browns have almost $50 million in cap space, and can afford to pay Collins. If they can't extend him before March, they can always franchise him for an estimated $15 million. In that case, they could continue to negotiate. Jackson also said he doesn't think Collins, who will debut for the Browns Sunday against the Cowboys, will struggle going from a Super Bowl contender to a winless team. "This young man gets it,'' Jackson said. "There are decisions sometimes that are out of a players' hands. He's just excited to have the opportunity and we're excited to have him here.'' Jackson, who needs big playmakers on a defense that has blown four second-half leads, also paid no mind to a report by former Browns general manager and former Patriots personnel executive Mike Lombardi that Collins was freelancing and that Bill Belichick "decided he was not going to allow it to happen'' any longer. "Hey, the way he freelances is okay with me,'' said Jackson. "What happened there is not what's important for us here. We see a player that's very talented and has a tremendous skillset that fits in with what we do. So he's a Cleveland Brown now.'' Primarily an outside 'backer in the Pats' 4-3 scheme, Collins (6-3, 250) was originally selected by them in the second round of 2013 out of Southern Miss. He's started 41 of his 50 games, totaling 285 career tackles, 10.5 sacks, five interceptions, 10 forced fumbles, four fumble recoveries, one defensive touchdown and one blocked extra point. Last season, he made his first Pro Bowl and was named to a second-team All-Pro. He played every snap in New England's victory in Super Bowl XLIX and led the team in tackles. He also led the club in that category in 2014 and 2015. This season, Collins started six of seven games, registering 43 tackles, two interceptions, one sack and one forced fumble. "He's a tremendous pass rusher, he can play linebacker, there's several things he can do,'' said Jackson. "He has a real versatile skill set, because he's done both there at New England. We'll definitely find ways to plug him in and have him be a contributing member to our defense.'' As for whether he'll play inside or out, Jackson said, "we'll see. Let's get him here. It's where his comfort level is what's most important. Jackson said he'll get Collins up to speed to play Sunday against Dak Prescott and the Cowboys at FirstEnergy Stadium. "As I said when I first came here, we're going to find a way to win,'' he said. "I'm not backing off of that.'' Terrelle Pryor studied extensive film of Collins in anticipation of the Browns' 33-13 loss to the Patriots on Oct. 9. Collins forced Pryor to fumble in that game, but he recovered. He also made three tackles and played 83% of the snaps. "He's an awesome player,'' said Pryor. "I was ecstatic when I saw we picked him up. Not that we're not happy with our teammates, but he's experienced, and he's made a lot of plays. He's a Pro Bowl guy. It's one of the first people that jumped out at me when we played those guys a few weeks back. It's a great pick up." Pryor said Collins' nose for the ball is what stands out. "His athleticism, his versatility, the way he runs to the ball,'' said Pryor. "He wasn't a big smack talker. He just wanted to get the job done. He was coached by one of the best coaches in the league. Now he's coming to a great coach as well in Hue. It was awesome. We got better today." Former Browns CEO Joe Banner tweeted that the Browns "loved Collins in the '13 draft. If he had lasted a few more picks, he would've been a Brown. (Browns defensive coordinator Ray) Horton was part of that.'' Collins has also been one of the highest-rated linebacker by profootballfocus.com over the past few years, including No. 11 in 2014 and No. 7 last year. This year, he's ninth, and ahead of where he was last year at this time. The trade marks the second time the two clubs have swapped a linebacker for a pick this season. The Browns sent 2013 first-rounder Barkevious Mingo to the Patriots in August for a fifth-round pick.
Patriots coach Bill Belichick is far too tight-lipped to offer a candid explanation of why he decided to trade linebacker Jamie Collins to the Browns. But a media member who knows Belichick well says it?s simple: Collins is playing like a dog, and Belichick wanted to get rid of him. Mike Lombardi, who worked for Belichick in both Cleveland and New England, said Collins isn?t playing well enough and isn?t trying hard enough. ?Watch the tape. Jamie has not played particularly well,? Lombardi said on WEEI. ?Sometimes freelancing is a problem, and I think sometimes effort is a problem.? Lombardi said Collins? status as a soon-to-be free agent had nothing to do with the decision, and he indicated that Collins has been told before that he needs to work harder. ?This is about football,? he said. ?This is about watching the player. Grade the player. People have a perception. You?re arguing based on perception. If you studied the game tape and you understood the defense, and you understood everything that?s going on, you would understand this is a football decision. . . . Jamie Collins, I?ve said this to this kid before when I was there. . . . When he wants to play and he?s really into it, he can be a very good player. Now, is there something going on in his life that I don?t know about? But through eight games as a Patriot this season he had not been playing at a level that?s acceptable to winning and beating good teams. The conversation we?re having isn?t about beating Landry Jones and the Pittsburgh Steelers. It?s about beating Ben Roethlisberger and the Pittsburgh Steelers in a championship game.? Told that Pro Football Focus has given Collins strong grades, Lombardi scoffed. ?Who is doing the grading? Evaluate the evaluator,? he said. ?I would rather go with Bill Belichick?s evaluation than Pro Football Focus.? As Lombardi repeatedly questioned Collins? production and praised Belichick?s decision to cut bait on him, one of the WEEI hosts told him, ?It does feel like you?re doing Belichick?s bidding.? Lombardi took issue with that, but his comments did sound like he was offering an opinion he knows Belichick shares, even if Belichick won?t say so publicly.
