If I'm Sashi and someone offered me a 2nd and a 4th think I'd have to jump on it. I don't see a scenario where someone would offer a 1st but that would obviously be a no brainer.
I don't see a scenario, right now, where someone will offer a 2nd... Now, IF he stays clean all season and gets back to playing like 2013..then yes. But for now, he can't be trusted. Anything lower than a 2nd and it isn't worth it.
I'll let you know Bluez by 7-8PM tomorrow. Should be back from a soccer team cookout by then. If I do take the spot, I can't make the draft since I'm back at work in the evenings for a couple of hours. But it's not like I've never gone with a "no-look/no-set-up autodraft before," so that won't bother me.
Looks to me like the "asking price" is actually a price from someone who really doesn't want to sell.
Erving and Gilbert have to go! I know it will cost to just cut these scrubs so right after this game I'm looking for a trade partner for each. Erving has been standing around all game. Gilbert can't cover a window. If I'm Jackson I'm throwing deep on every play. As I'm typing this Gordon just caught a deep TD pass at the end of the 2nd qrt., lol
"hey josh, how does it feel to score a touchdown again?" josh "i'm going to stripperland with my crew"
Honestly Els, I don't understand this post. I was thinking to myself last night, this is the best I've seen Gilbert play, except for the one play by Evans(who made others look silly last night as well). I kept quiet, because I thought maybe I was missing something. Re-watching the first half of the game right now and I really can't see where the hate for him is coming from as far as this game is concerned. He played pretty well. The pass rush was PITIFUL, Winston had all day to throw, when they were in position it didn't last long as Winston merely sidestepped all night long. This is my biggest worry going into the season...no pass rush = playing from behind a lot. Ervin...meh, he wasn't good...but he wasn't terrible either. Greco was getting beat worse than Ervin. Pasztor actually looked ok as well...Out of that right side, Greco worries me the least, I think they will be OK. Penalties, missed tackles and missed opportunities on defense (I counted 2 fumbles and 2 missed INTs in the first half alone) is what they need to work on the most. ________________________________________________________________________________________ On a brighter note... Gordon looks pretty damn good for not playing in over a year. Crowell and Duke played pretty well also. I think this offense has a chance to be special. A lot depends on the offense ability to run their game plan if the defense doesn't give up a big lead (27 points in the first half..20 points are on the defense) too early in the game. ___________________________________________________________________________________________ Oh...and where was Coleman? I know he played, but I only saw him out there on a couple of offensive plays and return teams. I was looking forward to seeing this kid, he must not have the offense down yet.
Not much to be optimistic about last night. We can't pressure the opposing QB at all, and if our QB doesn't get the ball out in 2.3 seconds, we're done...The O-line and D-line were terrible.... Bucs had wide open receivers all night, in virtually every situation. Jamies Winston had all day to pick us apart, and he made it look easy. Whatever he needed, it was there...That was disappointing. The few times we did force him into mistakes, we dropped the ball or had a penalty... The special teams couldn't have been worse. Chris Tabor was the only coach retained by this staff, but last nights' showing was an embarrassment,. Obviously they got plenty of work to do there... When ESPN shows the "highlights" from this game and inevitably the broadcaster makes the comment, "same ol' Browns"; don't be surprised..because for the most part, that looked every bit like the "same ol' Browns" to me..... Back to the drawing board....Maybe SI got it right, because they looked like a 1-15 team last night on offense, defense and special teams...I'm hoping that this was just one of those preseason games that turned ugly, but it looked a little too familiar for me to truly believe that.....sigh.
Morning Lounge Houndz *HI* Did get to watch a bit of the game last night. Some good, a bit more bad, and a Whole lot of UGLY!!! All I can say is that it is going to be a long long season fellow Brownies. Yeah it'll be fun to see Gordon and Griffin hook up for a few long TD's but those will be few and far between if the O-line keeps giving up that many sacks in a game. The Defense looked like it couldn't stop a back water HS offense where the kids play both ways. And once again the special teams unit doesn't look so special. I know it's early and only the preseason, but... *WALL* Catch ya'll in the draft room *DRINK*
Final gripe and then I'm done talking about last night's debacle.... Why did we waste the entire 3rd quarter watching Josh McCown lock in on Taylor Gabriel every single play?
Because guys like "Hollywood" were dropping balls...I think McCown is a) familiar with Gabriel and b) hoping to keep him around over the rookies. If the rookies don't step up, that's exactly what will happen and Stopper and/or Els will go on another tirade over wasted 4th round and lower draft picks... Right now locks: Corey Coleman Terrell Pryor Josh Gordon fairly safe: Andrew Hawkins Bubble for the final 1-3 spots (most likely 2-3 with Gordon missing 4 games): *Taylor Gabriel (has looked the best of the rest *Ricardo Lewis (out with an injury if I'm not mistaken) *Rashard Higgins Marlon Moore Jordan Payton Darius Jennings
Pat McManamon ESPN Staff Writer ?FacebookShare ?TwitterTweet ?PinterestPinterest @EmailEmail ?print ?comment The Cleveland Browns might look at Josh Gordon's late first-half touchdown catch as a good sign from Friday night's game in Tampa Bay. But if they let that obscure the other realities from this 30-13 loss to the Tampa Bay Buccaneers, they're fooling themselves. Prior to that touchdown throw, the offense struggled and the defense looked anemic. At certain points, it would have been hard for the Browns to look worse, which is concerning given it was the third preseason game, which by most accounts is supposed to be the most important one. With the starters on the field, the Browns didn't rush the passer, didn't stop the pass, didn't pass the ball, didn't protect the quarterback and didn't tackle on special teams. "We sprung a leak in a lot of different places," coach Hue Jackson said. Were it not for Gordon, they would not have come close to scoring. His 44-yard catch on the first third down of the game set up a field goal, and his acrobatic catch of a 43-yard touchdown late in the half gave the Browns their only TD. Those two plays accounted for 87 of the team's 163 total yards. The two plays count, but take them away and Robert Griffin III was 6-for-12 for 32 yards. He was sacked five times. He fumbled once. And after converting his first two third downs on throws to Gordon and Gary Barnidge, he missed his next five -- and was sacked on three of them. Griffin has been productive in the preseason when he can throw the ball deep to one of the Browns receivers running down the sideline, but the third preseason game did little to prove he's past the pocket passing issues that dogged him in Washington. "We cant just live by the long ball," Jackson said. "It's good. We're scoring. We'll take that, but at the same time we have to have other elements of our offense show up." Credit him and Gordon for the deep balls, but at this point of the preseason, it would have been nice to see the offense operate a little more efficiently and the defense at least provide token resistance to Jameis Winston. This was a bad third preseason game. "I'm not going to accept this," Jackson said. "We're going to go back to work and fix this." QB depth chart: Jackson gave Griffin one half, then went right to Josh McCown. There will be no change in this depth chart. Griffin will be the Browns' starter. Maybe that player could start: The Browns have this receiver who will be suspended the first four games of the season. Guy named Gordon, first name Josh. Guy who's tall, can run like a gazelle, has amazing ability to get balls that are up for grabs and who makes a quarterback better. Jackson probably can't wait for the fifth game. Who got hurt? Cornerback Justin Gilbert left the game in the second quarter with a concussion. Backup receiver and special teams standout Marlon Moore left in the first half with a hip injury. When it was starters vs. starters, the Browns looked ... : Brutally overmatched, which isn't good given this is the "key" preseason game. At one point, the Bucs were doing everything they wanted and led 27-3 with six minutes left in the second quarter. Consider these first half stats: Winston threw for 259 yards and two touchdowns. The Bucs had 305 yards to 163 for the Browns. And the Bucs passing game produced 259 yards to the Browns' 98. Big plays to Gordon or no big plays, this was a dud. One reason to be concerned: Danny Shelton was the 12th overall pick in the 2015 draft, the first of two first-round picks. Though he forced a second-half fumble, he has not been very visible in preseason. Whether that is cause for concern is up for debate, but Shelton has gone two games in a row in which he played in the third quarter. That is not typical for starters. Protection or decisions? On two third downs in the first half, Griffin was sacked. On both, he had time to throw and either saw nobody to throw to or did not make a decision. Or, according to Jackson, he ran out of time. "We're not holding the ball too long," Jackson said. The concern: That kind of play from the pocket cost Griffin his job in Washington. He has the confidence of his coach in Cleveland, but it would have been nice to see him make a throw from the pocket. His big plays in the preseason have all been on throws when he flung it deep to receivers running down the sideline. Excitement fizzles: There was a lot of chatter about getting Gordon, Terrelle Pryor and first-round pick Corey Coleman on the field for the first time. Gordon produced on two deep balls. Pryor had two receptions for 15 yards and after missing one third down, complained to the official about a penalty that was not called. Coleman had one reception, but it was called back by penalty. He had two other targets, but did not have a reception. Clearly there is work to be done. Special failures: It wasn't just the offense and defense that let down. Special teams contributed, as well. The starters gave up a 73-yard punt return for a touchdown in the first half, the backups a 43-yard return that set up a field goal in the second half. This was not a good night for the team.
Bluez, that article is spot on in summing up how disappointing the Browns were yesterday. Hue put it more briefly though by stating, "we can't just live by the long ball." RG looked more scared in the pocket most of the time than poised and in charge. The defense was pathetic, but in fairness, so was the running game. If you want to call it that. Things have to change, and fast. Rok *BYE*
Irish why did Jackson say "We can't throw deep every time"? This line is terrible. I seen RGIII and RB's on the ground and Erving standing there looking back at least 3 times. Gilbert was a high 1st rd draft pick and will play. That's the only reason. Evans was catching the ball all over the field. The only thing this team has done good is throw the ball deep. Improvement is what I want to see. Each and every week. I know this team is lacking defensive impact players but this defense has to get after the QB and cover someone. Ive been on record to not expect to many wins. Maybe 3/4 but thats it. This year I want to see who deserves to to a Brown next year. Right now Erving, Gilbert and Shelton don't look to good. I have no faith in these players to get better. Why? I have/had no faith in Ray Farmer. I know how good Evans is. I wanted him or Watkins and instead got BUST GILBERT and Johnny Drunk,lol But those days are behind us know,lol Not a good showing from the Browns. All I have learned from watching them this pre season is that they can throw the ball but the defense is terrible. Hopefully next year they can get a real pass rushing OLB, a real ILB and a SS or CB to help this secondary. Passing game will be good but defense will struggle.
I'm not disagreeing that there is a lot of work to be done...but, the running game was pathetic?? The two main backs averaged 4.9ypc and 7.3ypc, combined they had 11 carries for 61 yards in the first half at 5.5ypc...How in the hell is that pathetic? The line gave RGIII time to throw on most plays..This is the NFL, you don't get 4 seconds to make a decision. Really the one lineman that I can say struggled was Greco, but I expect him to get that handled as he has shown he can play very well at this level. I hope you all realize this is preseason and this is not a regular game plan. Not to mention, they were getting first downs, the offense didn't downright suck, they had some key penalties, like Joe Thomas being called for a false start when the defender ran into him before he moved. Thomas was also removed after the first quarter, which will immediately throw the chemistry off on the line, yet I thought they did a fine job anyway.
He said it because you don't have time on every damn play to wait for a route to develop...this is the NFL. The timing pattern passes should be their bread and butter, but either the receivers aren't running crisp enough routes, RGIII can't throw the short to intermediate throws or it is simply because they haven't had enough practice to get timing down with Gordon and Coleman who have been out with injuries. Pryor, who has been the healthy one, has had success this preseason on the type of plays Jackson wants to see more of. You need to re-watch the game...I did see Erving alone on some plays, but his job is to make sure he doesn't let the middle come through and then protect that middle from a delayed blitz, looking for someone to block doesn't mean he wasn't doing his job. He didn't miss a block causing undo pressure prematurely...what the hell do you want from him? Block his guys AND both guards guys at the same time? Yes, I agreed Evans was catching the ball all over the field, but besides the burn, he only caught ONE ball on Gilbert for 3 yards. The rest of the time Gilbert was in there, he actually played pretty well. Most of the damage Evans did wasn't against #21, it was against #41 the rookie Tracy Howard. I have been very negative on Gilbert, more so than probably any other draft pick of the Browns, but this game wasn't a reason to trash him. They are giving Howard every opportunity to make this team, but from what I have seen, the UDFA has not shown me a reason to give him a roster spot. That's my point, they are playing players that wouldn't normally be in there so that they can make the tough decisions that are coming on them fast. In normal situations, either Tramon Williams or Jamar Taylor will be in there across from Haden. Defense didn't look good, imo it was fundamentals. Missed tackles were embarrassing.
I don't know why I keep dwelling on this...it's the damn preseason...but while we are "talking", why isn't there mention of Nassib and Ogbah whom have both had flashes of what might be a bright future? Very young players that are showing they can rise to this next level. With further development, this defense could begin to come together. It isn't 100% doom and gloom...man it is so depressing to have to talk about every little negative, while some of you refuse to even acknowledge any positive.
