Psst. I was, in truth, directing that at one individual. Hey, I'm a Buffalo fan! I know about being thick skinned when it comes to (attempted) abuse by fans of other teams.
Mayb ur missing the point....u keep bringing up Schwartz and Sheard, but the Browns let them walk for whatever reason so it doesnt matter if they become the best ever....these players over the span of 3-5 shuld b ur nucleus and leaders by now 2011 draft Taylor Sheard Little Cameron Marecic Skrine Pinkston Hagg Every player is gone from the team 2012 T Rich Weeden Schwartz Hughes Benjamin Michael-Johnson R. Miller Acho Winn Wade 1 guy still on the team 2013 Mingo McFadden Slaughter Bryant Gilkey 1 guy still on the team and the other is susp 2014 Gilbert Manz Bitonio Kirksey West Desir 4 guys on the team I believe thats 6 guys still on the team out of 29 draft picks(unreal) and ur talking bout picks that were really high in the draft...I can bet there isnt nother team in the NFL even close 2 that and out of those 6 I think only 2 start...smh Irish, U, me, Lym and SAS wuld have a much better % and we do our homework at home
No, I think you are missing the point... I can almost state with a certainty, if "My guys" or "YOUR guys" (meaning coaching staff) were given 1-2 years to either make the playoffs or be replaced, then I would profoundly state, I believe, no matter who I chose in the draft, they would have an extremely difficult time succeeding at the pro level. It takes a cohesive body of coaching to succeed at the next level, if that is not available, then a player will either become stagnant or skills could easily diminish. Environment plays a bigger role in development than simple raw talent.
If talent is there coaches keep their jobs...turnover wuld b limited....I believe Cincy proves this point...they lost DCs and OCs and still made the playoffs cause of talent...the Browns didnt have much talent therefore record was bad and coaches needed 2 go
Compare the early careers of Von Miller and Gordon. Similar "lifestyle" issues & concerns; both were obviously hugely talented. Von Miller is feted as the SB hero, now. And, he's become very wealthy. That is a stark contrast to Gordon. There are a lot of contributing factors and I do not want to become too simplistic. But, I believe that the coaching and FO differences are major between Denver and Cleveland and that contributed significantly to their respective career trajectories.
Everytime you make one of these statements you force me to go back and pull one of your posts from years ago. The latest... April 20, 2013 That's a rough list Showstopper.
1. If he stays healthy....he hasnt 2. Indy ran a 3-4 def and tried making him a OLB 3. had his best yr in 2015 and they still have no QB 4. played in 46 of 48 games....not a bad pick at all 5. just traded 4 a great player in Chandler Jones so Billy must think highly of him 6. cant stay healthy...bust so far 7. very positive early career so far and earned a huge contract 8. still w the team that drafted him but can improve 9. productive DT that allows Keuchly 2 make plays all over the field 10. starting DT on a playoff team Not sure whats wrong w those guys and why its such a rough list
So your are saying Werner "failed" because of coaching and not talent? Is THAT what you are saying? So you are saying that Warmack merely playing games is a sign of success, not necessarily becoming an ALL PRO? Is THAT what you are saying? So you are saying Cooper playing for another team isn't necessarily a failure on the drafting teams part? Is THAT what you are saying? So the fact Minter is still with the team that drafted him IS a good thing? Is THAT what you are saying? So Lotulelei helping others to do their job, while being productive is a good thing {cough} John Hughes {cough}? Is THAT what you are saying? So, the mere fact that Floyd starts on a playoff team is the measure of a great draft pick? So when the Browns make the playoffs, any of these guys that are on the team will go from duds to studs overnight? Is THAT what you are saying? You have a lot of excuses for YOUR thoughts on draft picks, but when I use coaching as my "excuse" for the players non-development, it is the players fault for the coaches losing their jobs...So it is the responsibility of the 21-23 year old players to make 30-60 year old men good coaches, not the other way around... Got it..
No Im saying Werner failed cause of the system. Did u read above I said a 4-3 DE Warmack playing in that many games shows hes good enough 2 b a starter. Cooper getting traded for Jones shows he has talent cause Jones is a very good player. Minter still w the team is my whole point of the last couple of days....the Browns drafted so many guys and their already cut or out of football. Star plays on a team that was ranked top 3 in def and went 2 the SB...John Hughes was playing on the worst def in football and winng 3 games....good comparison...I guess he did his job lol. Browns wont make the playoffs any time soon so dont need 2 talk bout that, but Floyd is a very good player and wuld b a starter on the Browns the minute he walked into Berea. u can name the best coach in the history of the game and he wuldnt have won w the Browns roster over the last 5 yrs
Gordon has problems in college being susp(drugs) and transferred out of school...Miller played all his yrs at A&M
College is not part of one's career; it is preparation for it. That is one reason why your reply is not germane. The other reason is that it does absolutely nothing to counter my point. Neither the Browns nor the Broncos had an iota of influence on either person until they entered the NFL. A player's coach and his team's FO have greater influence on him than he does on the team.
Gordon has had problems since he was a teenager...players have perfect behavior then they get paid and their lives change....the organization has nothing 2 do w it...Aikman, Moose, Novacek and Smith were pretty much straight and narrow...then comes along Hardy, McClain, Bryant etc...did the organization all of a sudden change
*DRINK* Thanks Duff!! Only FIVE days to the opening of training camp!! I don't know which to be more excited over right now, the Indians or the Browns! Go Tribe! Games matter more than practice at this point!
I forgot about that. I'll be heading out for vacation when camp opens. Keep this thread up to date for me Irish. Not sure I'll be getting much Browns news in Barbados, but I can access the interwebs at the hotel.
Yes, they have GREAT rum down there! So, are you specifically going to Barbados? The wife and I went on a cruise in those parts a few years back and flew back from Barbados, all we did was travel from the boat to a restaurant for lunch then the airport. Looked like a beautiful place for an extended stay.
