Now for the record, we are on the same page... I also believe Hoyer is the product of Shanahan and even Norv Turner before him. I think Hoyer can fit a system to a tee and not make crucial mistakes to cost the team a game. Problem is, when he needs to be the catalyst for the offense, he simply doesn't have the tools to be that kind of QB. Hoyer needs for the defense to have the onus of stopping the offense, not be the person to attack the defense. He needs something like a great running game to open up play action and get wide open receivers when the pass is called. He needs for an up tempo offense to throw a defense off their game plan. These are weaknesses that he is good enough to overcome on many instances, but cannot overcome them without help. That was highlighted by the Jags defense yesterday. Hoyer now has 9 starts in the NFL(I don't count the Buffalo game), he needs to grow immensely to become a regular starter that can be counted on every Sunday. I love the guy, but he simply isn't a top tier QB...yet
I dont ever call anyone an idiot, put up pictures in a degrading manner or anything along those lines...if someone can find me disrespecting them in a post I wuld like to see it.
irish, the reason I wrote that 1st sentence is because some people just think its done on purpose.....heck we had an argument bout Hoyer all week w some posters and now their kinda changing their tune....message boards are always gonna have debates so I dont understand when people get upset if they disagree w someones opinion
I agree 100% Lym about that decision at the end of the first half... My question is, was it an overconfidence of a guy wanting to take the game over? Or was it a reflection on this current roster. Injuries dictate they may not hold up the whole game...then there is the fact our kicker is not the greatest over 40 yards, career 72%? If it is the latter, I believe they need to be finding a replacement. They must have confidence in the players. They can't let doubt creep into their minds when making crucial decisions on the field. Great read Lym, as always! The team had holes coming in and injuries are killing us right now. We need next man up, to step up!
I admit that Pettine didn't call me for advise but I suspect he made that call to further instill the "Win Now" mentality in the team. What better way than to tell them "I have all the confidence in you to get the 1st down and keep the ball in our hands." Unfortunately, they didn't get the 1st down and it bit him square in the ass.
most likely Lym...to be honest, I love the aggressive play calling. It really pisses me off that they throw to the sidelines with 1 yard to go. If you want to say "come and stop us" RUN THE DAMN BALL and get your yard!!
Agree except that the Jags had been stopping the run (for no gain or a loss) for most of the 1st half. I think he wanted to keep the drive alive and figured that JAX would key on a run and opted to surprise them with a short pass to the flat.
2 things i learned...Browns aren't as good as I thought...Jags aren't as bad as I thought. And those 2 undeniable facts hit me like a ton of bricks yesterday...It was almost as crazy as the SB Champs losing to the Rams. I don't mind that they went for it on that play you guys are talking about, and I don't mind that they threw it....lack of execution always makes things easy to second guess. I welcomed the agressiveness, so I can't cry because it blew up on us.. I actually watched that crap again today...In the NFL, if ya aren't ready to play on Sunday, you lose. Cleveland was just out prepared. Credit to the Jags. Every time we treid to fool them, they were ready. Everytime we got even the slightest momentum going, they snuffed it out. They sure as hell didn't play like a winless team on defense. They shut Cleveland down. I don't know if it was playcalling or our lack of execution, but it was ugly all day.. Forget about it and move on to the Raiders, because if they play anything like that again next week in front of the home crowd, they are going to get smoked again.....
Maybe you guys could petition the NFL for a few more games against the Steelers? You'll be playoff bound.
Up til yesterday, I felt like we had progressed each game. Yesterday was a giant step backward into 2013. That helpless feeling was back. Yuck! So after 6 games we stand at 500. Honestly I can't be that upset by the record, it's how we got here, specifically this last game that just crushes the spirit. Hoyer can't repeat that performance or he gets his old job back. The O line has to find their mojo again now that Mack is not there to guide them. Without a running game we have to rely on a passing game that will find much narrower windows if the play action is negated. Hoyer's game is to work the run / pass in harmony, using the space granted by the run to allow our "starless" recievers to find space. Hoyer hasn't shown the ability to lead the team with his arm, so if the line doesn't open holes, and protect like they did for the first 5 games he better learn quickly. It's not all on him, but with Johnny sitting on the sidelines, and management committed to him "at some point" Hoyer's margin for error is pretty thin. I want to see if Hoyer / the staff can take this one on the chin and answer the bell this week. The first "true" adversity of the year. How do we respond? Are we the SOBs, or can we bury that moniker along with the factory of sadness? I've got my black suit for the funeral. C'mon Pet, now it's time to earn your paycheck big guy.
*THUMBSUP* Thanks Lym Can't hide from the truth. :[ The Browns offense was... well just plain Offensive :! It is almost as if the Browns a play to the level of their competition. Bad vs bad teams and good vs good teams. *WALL* Jekyll and Hyde syndrome. %) I'll take it with salt and pepper thx... Spoiler As much as I don't think JF is mature enough yet to command the offense without giving us all ulcers and headaches going through the growing pains. Hoyer's performance was about as ugly as it gets. I'm not sure yet if losing Mack is that detrimental to the success of the offense, though after last week *SCRATCH* Let's hope that they get that straightened out. I still don't fully understand why they don't have Gilbert doing/trying punt/kick returns. Could it hurt? If i recall correctly he wasn't too bad at that in college. Hopefully they can put that one behind them and move on to the Raiders.
Extra Points ? Go north: Terrance West didn?t like the ?baby backs? nickname somebody coined for fellow rookie Isaiah Crowell and him after Game 1. If he doesn?t alter his running style in short yardage carries, people might start calling him Terrance East-West. West failed to convert consecutive short-yardage carries in the first half in Jacksonville because he stuttered-stepped in search of bigger plays. He gained 1 yard on a second-and-2 carry at the Jaguars? 25-yard line, and then was stacked up for no gain on third-and-1. On Monday, West repeated a coaching point that the coaches have made to him. ?I was trying to go for the big play,? he said. ?When it comes down to it, I should?ve just got the first down. "If I?d have kept running outside on the (third) down, I?d probably have gotten seven yards more. I just stopped and tried to cut back in and go for the bigger play instead of going for the first down. I ran into the back of my offensive lineman. I wish I could get it back, just got to learn from it and let it be motivation.? Those failed opportunities turned crucial when Mike Pettine elected to go for it on fourth down rather than try a 42-yard field goal and go up, 9-0. The Jaguars defended the play and converted the turnover on downs into a touchdown and a 7-6 lead at halftime. They never surrendered it. And West never returned to the field in the second half. The first back in to relieve starter Ben Tate, West totaled 10 offensive snaps ? all in the first half. Crowell had 23 and Tate had 41. West attributed his desire to swing for the fences to his limited play time in the crowded Browns? backfield. ?On that play right there, I know I?ve got limited reps,? he said. ?So I know when I?m in the game, I?m trying to get that big play. I?ve got to go back to the books and take what the defense gives me. I?m a rookie, I?m going to learn from it. Some of the best running backs that ever played the game, they did the same mistakes. It?s all about how you react to it.? Last week, Pettine remarked about distractions changing based on wins v. losses. The crowded backfield situation is a prime example. When the Browns win, it?s a good problem to have. When they lose, and the backs are stuffed for 2.3 a carry, it?s framed as a problem because none of the backs gets in a rhythm. Pettine said Monday, ?We?ll have discussions this week as to how best to rotate those guys. You can make the argument it?s a good problem to have.? Upon further review: Pettine was asked if he second-guessed himself for not kicking the field goal to go up, 9-0. ?When it doesn?t work, absolutely,? he said. Then he elaborated, ?I thought we were playing well defensively. It turned out the worst-case scenario for us. The way the game was going and how they were defending us, we didn?t have a great feel for how many more times we?d get down to the 20. When it was second and 1, we made the decision it was four-down mode. You live with it.? Roster changes: The Browns waived fullback Ray Agnew and replaced him with fullback Kiero Small. Agnew, one of several undrafted rookies to make the opening day roster, had started all six games. Small, a seventh-round draft pick of Seattle, had been on the practice squad since the Seahawks cut him in July. ?As we talk about often, we?re built on the premise of competition,? Pettine said. ?We?ve had Kiero here since the end of training camp. We debated drafting him and hoped we could get him. When he became available we signed him to practice squad. He?s been doing outstanding job for us on scout team and felt it was time to see what he could do.? Also, nose tackle Jacobbi McDaniel, who was promoted from the practice squad last week and activated in Jacksonville, Tweeted that he was cut by the Browns on Monday. The Browns had no immediate announcement on that roster move. Brownie bits: Pettine was asked if he considered using Johnny Manziel to spark the slumbering offense in Jacksonville. ?We didn?t,? he said, adding, ?It was discussed briefly, but it was a situation where we still wanted to end the game with Brian.?? The center-right guard combination will be under review again this week. Efforts are being made to prepare newly activated Nick McDonald to play center and move John Greco back to right guard. If McDonald needs more time, Greco would stay at center and Vinston Painter would join Paul McQuistan in competition at right guard ? Pettine said that nose tackle Ahtyba Rubin sought a second opinion on his ankle injury and surgery has not been ruled out. Rubin's status for this week is uncertain ... This is what West had to say about the 24-6 loss to the previously winless Jaguars: ?Yesterday they were the better team. They made a lot more plays than we did. They wanted it more than we did. When you look back at it, we looked like the 0-6 team and they looked like the 3-2 team.?
Terrance West was benched after failing to pick up a first down on a pair of second-quarter carries in Sunday's loss at Jacksonville. West was actually playing ahead of Isaiah Crowell to open the game. He had room to run in both critical short-yardage situations, but tried to do too much. "I missed it," he said. "Wish I could get it back. ... I know I've got limited reps. So I know when I'm in a game, I'm trying to get a big play." On Monday, coach Mike Pettine lamented trying to get three running backs into the rotations. We wouldn't be surprised if West goes back to healthy scratch status this week, leaving Crowell to pick up all the work behind Ben Tate against the Raiders.
. He has a hard time covering anyone . maybe he can return punts ? not what you want out of the #9 pick in the draft . pick me apart if you want to but other than Bitonio at guard Farmers first draft isn't looking real promising here
The Bengals, who have qualified for the playoffs in three straight years, have had trouble selling tickets this year. In the midst of an 0-2-1 slump, the Bengals face arguably their biggest box-office test of the season; they?ve got three home games in a 12-day span. ?We still have tickets available for each of the three games and are working hard to sell as many as we can and get the games on TV,? Bengals ticket sales manager Andrew Brown said. On Sunday, the Bengals host the Ravens. The following Sunday, the Bengals host the Jaguars. Four days later, the Browns come to town for a Thursday night game. The Bengals decided before the season to reduce their non-premium ticket threshold to 85 percent to ensure that the games will be televised locally, but they?re still facing the possibility of one or more blackouts. No NFL games have been blacked out on local TV yet this year. Last month, the FCC voted to end government support for the blackout rule. The league and the broadcast networks still have the ability to privately agree not to televise the games, if they aren?t sold out within 72 hours before kickoff. If/when the NFL continues to black out games, Congress could intensify efforts to force the NFL to permit all games to be televised in the local market, regardless of the amount of tickets sold.
at what point should they get it ? West is a RB they traded up to get when WR was a far bigger need . Deshir looked lost in pre season and hasn't been active on game days yet . Gilbert is getting roasted out there in coverage . then again it took Skrine three years to prove his worth . he was a fifth round pick . youtake a CB at #9 one would think he should start and contribute . I know its your nature to defend . I just don't like what I have seen to date out of any of them other than Bitonio . Crowell who wasn't drafted is out playing them all
