Sarcasm I love it . Like Jimmy Buffet said if we couldn't laugh we would all go insane ..part of being a die hard lifelong Browns fans . If it isn't one thing it's another . HAHAHAHAHAHAHAH..Laughing I am .
Bluez... that's the guy. I'm not excited about the pick at all, but it fills a need. Our FS position is so weak, he has a legitimate chance to start. He's no Earl Thomas, but almost anyone is an upgrade to Young and Hagg.
Puzzling beyond belief OK. I confess. I have no idea what happened the past three days. It?s like I?ve been lost in a dream. I dreamed the Browns entered the National Football League college draft with high hopes of strengthening the team. And then that dream turned sour because all the Browns did was make some of the strangest moves I?ve seen any team make in the annual lottery. I dreamed they made their first pick a relatively inexperienced defensive end who projects as an outside linebacker. Kind of a bummer since a very good cornerback, a position of great need, was available. Nonetheless, I dreamed on. The second round drifted by without attempting to retrieve the pick they lost when selecting Josh Gordon in the supplemental draft last summer. Why not? Joe Banner makes dreams come true, doesn?t he? Not this time. All right. No need to panic. There?s always the rest of the draft and Joe will come through for Browns Nation. I dreamed he chose a little cornerback from San Diego State in the third round. What?s going on here? You have a chance to get a bigger, better corner in the first round and then take a guy who needs to stand on his tiptoes to reach 5-10 in the third round? This dream is beginning to take on a foul aroma. What?s going on here? I began to stir. What in the world is the rest of the draft going to look like for Cleveland? It got worse. Much worse. I dreamed Banner made a trade with the Steelers in the fourth round. Yep, the Steelers of Pittsburgh. The dreaded Pittsburgh Steelers. The hated Pittsburgh Steelers. Picked up a third-rounder in next year's draft for the effort. Total blasphemy. Damn deal almost woke me up. The last time the Browns and Steelers swung a trade, Lyndon Johnson was in the White House, the draft lasted 17 rounds and the Browns were a very good football team. Forty-five years ago, the Browns swindled the Steelers out of quarterback Bill Nelsen and safety Jim Bradshaw for quarterback Dick Shiner, defensive tackle Frank Parker and a draft choice. Nelsen gave the Browns four very good seasons (36-19-1) before his knees finally gave out. To make matters worse, Banner snubbed his nose at the draft again in the fifth round and collected a second fourth-rounder next year from Indianapolis. What? The Steelers didn?t want to go for the daily double? Five rounds, two defensive picks for a team crying for help on the other side of the ball. Hope the denizens of the Ivory Tower brought some good reading material because they weren?t doing much drafting. They perked up temporarily when they picked up a veteran wide receiver, Davone Bess, from the Miami Dolphins in a meh kind of a deal. The dream picked up speed in the final two rounds with three selections. Either that or someone spiked the decaf. A safety, defensive end and guard just like that. Wow!! A veritable bonanza. It was as though the middle-round talent stunk, but for some reason the talent level picked up as the draft sped toward its conclusion. Then something very strange happened. I woke up and found out the dream was not a dream after all. It was very real. And it was every bit a nightmare. I have watched many drafts over the years. I?ve seen good ones and bad ones. Smart ones and stupid ones. But this one is clearly the most bizarre I?ve seen produced by a Cleveland group. And that takes some doing, especially in the last 14 years. It actually makes the work of Dwight Clark, Butch Davis, Phil Savage and Eric Mangini look relatively good. Won?t include Tom Heckert Jr. here because he was good to begin with. When all the dust had cleared, we were all treated to the humming of the Browns? spin machine. The spinmeisters took center stage on Berea and patted themselves on the back. Predictably, they used Gordon when rationalizing the events of the past three days ?We think of our draft as the five players we drafted today, plus Josh Gordon, plus Bess, plus two quality future draft picks,? Banner told the media. ?When you look at what we did take, before the (Colt) McCoy trade, we had six draft picks. What value did we turn that into? It?s Gordon, Bess, plus the players we picked, plus the two future assets we?ve acquired. And hopefully, we made good decisions with the undrafted guys.? Huh? The rationale continued. ?Listen,? he said, ?we?re not asking for a free pass this year. We expect to improve. We expect it to be conspicuous. We expect, as you look at the individual players we?ve added and the way that coaches bring them together, get them in sync and be better, we?re not saying we don?t expect to get better. We?re not going to reach all of our goals or fill all our needs this year. But we think we?ll play exciting, aggressive football.? That?s an awful lot of bullroar packed into one thought. He never uttered the word ?winning? in his remarks. Aggressive? Yes, if Rob Chudzinski follows through on his pre-season promises. Exciting? That remains to be seen. As for the free pass, don't worry, Joe. That ain't happening By pandering to those fans who buy tickets, Banner is just doing his job. Still, he should be made to listen to that nonsense again as a fan rather than the man charged with running the team. The smart fans will read between the lines and see the three-day exercise that just concluded did not make the Browns any better than they were prior to 8 p.m. Thursday. Adding Bess and draft selections Barkevious Mingo, Leon McFadden, Jamoris Slaughter, Armonty Bryant and Garrett Gilkey will have little, if any, effect on where the Browns will finish this season. And we all know where that will be. Don't believe that? Take a look at how the Baltimore Ravens, Pittsburgh Steelers and Cincinnati Bengals did in the draft. Then draw your own conclusions. No, the likes of Paul Kruger, Desmond Bryant, Quentin Groves and David Nelson will have a much greater impact on how well the the team performs this season. Banner was correct in one aspect, although he did not mention their names. In coordinators Ray Horton and Norv Turner, the Browns have hired two of the best. Their acumen in bringing out the best of the talent on board will be put to a severe test, though, since Banner did not help them in this draft. If this is a portent of things to come from the Banner team, hang on Browns fans. The ride will be exceedingly bumpy. Final draft grade (trying very hard here to be fair): C-------. About as close to a D as you can get without actually getting it. Posted by Rich Passan at 11:53 PM 8 comments:
I can see the Patriots picking him up and using him in packages .he is no starter but could run a few option plays maybe ? you will have to get creative in how you use him . the Pats or else he heads to Canada .
I too woke up Saturday morning and again on Sunday morning wondering "WHAT THE HELL JUST HAPPENED" But then I had a lot of time on my hands Sunday because of rained out softball games and I was(predictably) able to rationalize some of what occurred. I know you all see me as the eternal homer, and I am...but there is some merit in what I see. Let me start by using an example of a team that is spurted out way too much as to why the Browns lose...The Steelers and their ability to plug in draft picks to replace players in their system... Steelers draft history: In the past 21 drafts spanning 20 years, the Steelers have only drafted 6 defensive backs in the first two rounds(37 picks) To expand on this...their current depth chart looks like this on defense in regards to draft picks or free agency: LDE 1st round draft pick of the Steelers NT undrafted free agent of the Steelers RDE 7th round draft pick of the Steelers LOLB 2nd round draft pick of the Steelers(played 4-3 DE at Michigan) LILB 4th Round draft pick of the Steelers RILB 1st round draft pick of the Steelers ROLB 1st round draft pick of the Steelers LCB 4th round draft pick of the Steelers SS 1st round draft pick of the Steelers FS Unrestricted free agent from the Redskins RCB 4th round draft pick of the Steelers Now you can see where the importance lies in the heads of the Steelers organization.. Here is the current depth chart of the Browns after one offseason: LDE 6th round draft pick of the Browns (Rubin) NT 1st round draft pick of the Browns (Taylor) RDE Unrestricted free agent from the Raiders(Bryant in 2013) LOLB Unrestricted free agent from the Ravens(Kruger in 2013) LILB Undrafted free agent of the Browns(Robertson) RILB 2nd round draft pick of the Browns(Jackson) ROLB 2nd round draft pick of the Browns(Sheard, with 2013 1st round draft pick Mingo in the mix) LCB 1st round draft pick of the Browns(Haden) SS 2nd round draft pick of the Browns(Ward) FS 7th round draft pick of the Browns(Hagg) RCB 3rd round draft pick of the Browns(McFadden in 2013) So as you can see, we are moving towards what the Steelers have done in prioritizing the LB position in drafts going forward...We are also still ahead of the curve on our DBs to what the Steelers have Steelers average draft spot; 4.25 round Browns average draft spot; 3.25 round, a full round higher average Proves the theory that in this system(which the Browns are moving to) the LBs(and thus the pass rush) are the most important aspects of the defense... Now we have arguably better depth at those rush LB positions than even the Steelers after entering the season with almost none..
Again, after some careful thought, I can rationalize...(even the Steelers trade believe it or not) First off, they have given Ray Horton the tools needed to run his defense in 2013..Arguably Norv Turner already had the pieces needed to run his offense...upgrades needed? Of course, but what team in the NFL doesn't need upgrades? Secondly, I actually understand the rationale of using draft picks as assets... Thirdly, I must at the very least admit at the end of the day I trust college and pro scouts more than I do TV/Radio analysts. After all, do any of you think for a minute these guys would rather spend their days writing blogs instead of working for a professional sports team? The Real scouts are in place for a reason and these analysts are where they are for a reason(save for Mike Lombardi)... So, If I am entering the 4th round of the draft and ask my scouts for a valid report and they tell me it is slim pickings, the ultimate goal at that point is to trade down or out of the round. Goal reached, trade down from original spot and acquire a veteran wide receiver(which 90% of the fanbase has been wanting for 4 years) Pick comes up a second time, manage to not only NOT pick a player our scout department deemed too high, they trade the pick in conference(this is where the Steelers part come in) so that they "weaken" their roster by taking a player too high, but they also manage to improve on next year's draft when all hopes are there are better prospects to choose from. At the very least, you have ammunition to improve other draft picks to move up and get a guy you covet without sacrificing original draft picks. Did the same thing in the 5th round with the Colts. The point of these 2 draft picks and beyond in my mind is this, if there wasn't a guy our scouts felt would improve the roster and need replaced immediately, why make the pick at all? The next 3 draft picks were obviously throw aways because they couldn't move them to someone else...So you take the biggest risk/reward available to you at that time... 6th round a safety who was hurt multiple times in college, but could turn into a starter if he loses the injury bug.. 7th round you dig deep into your scouting departments notes and find the highest possibility of of lower conference players and take one's you feel have a possibility of acclimating to the professional level...after all, they are most likely throw aways anyway... I think this is what happened in the end...and after that, if you accept the scouting departments findings, I can live with how it went.
At the end of the day the Browns needed (2) OLBs, a CB and a FS to run Ray Horton's defense on a skeleton crew... They found not only (2) OLBs, but (3) which allows them the ability to rotate in fresh legs throughout the game..another important aspect of a relentless defense. They also took, who the scouts and coaching staff deemed best available(not a TV/Radio personality), a CB that projects to start opposite one of the best in the NFL in Haden. What they didn't do was improve the FS position, but did we in reality expect them to put in viable starters at every position in one off-season? They have really good players along the defensive line, whether they go 3 or 4 man front.. They also now have multiple look LBers that can play multiple positions without having to substitute. The defense on paper looks much like a 3-4 hybrid defense after this off-season...NO WAY could you say that before. The offense is what it is I'm afraid. It will depend on the arm of Brandon Weeden no matter what. But he does have players at every position to run the system he is implementing...I just hope Jordan Cameran pans out as a viable receiving threat.
IrishDawg42 wrote: In a word . . . Yes. Our positions of need were so bad (including FS), that bypassing the chance to make an improvement THIS YEAR in hopes of MAYBE improving that same next year IMHO is unacceptable. 13 years of ineptitude (10 consecutive) is unacceptable. You're young, Irish. You can afford to wait, and wait, and wait, and wait some more. I'm not.
THX Irish. Granted this new regime didn't completely overhaul the roster, and there are better pieces to the puzzle in place. That still doesn't change the fact that I am PHUQIN tired of hearing the CEO/GM/HC tell me and everyone else be patient, in 2-3 years the Browns will compete. How much longer will this endless wait till next year shtuff end :/ I agree w/ Lym its old, very phuquing old. I want to hear that they want to win and win NOW! In fact I DEMAND IT, and I think every Browns fan should too. Lombardi and Banner want us to believe that they are doing it right. PROVE IT. PROVE IT by WINNING. and until then I'm not drinikng their kool-aid, nor am I buying into the bovine feces that they are selling. In fact I'll be going across the street to Pilot Flying J's competitor and buying my gas. If Jim Bob wants my business at the pump, in the stadium and at the NFL shop. Tell Joe and Mike that they HAVE to win NOW!
Where are you going to get this player though Lym? I cannot with authority say there was a FS available 4th round or later that would improve this roster over Hagg or Gipson..I guess that was my point...If a player is seen as one that would need to be replaced IMMEDIATELY why take him, instead of improving the 2014 draft(which is when you will be taking players to improve that pick anyway)?
Here in lies the problem imho... The Browns fanbase HAS demanded winning and to this point the ownership has listened to the fanbase and REPLACED regime after regime asking for something that happens by accident, not grown.. When will it stop? When the ownership stops heeding the demands of change from a fanbase looking for a quick high! The Steelers and Ravens haven't done a miracle turn around and sustained it..They both have taken regimes and groomed and grown them into organizations that can adapt to the changes of the NFL. Starting over every 2-3 years is detrimental to the health of an organization and THAT IS WHAT I WANT TO STOP! One thing I can almost guarantee, if they continue to change every few years, you aren't the only one that will not live to see a championship!
Nor can you, with authority, say that a FS taken with the 4th or 5th round pick would not have improved the position. Ever heard the phrase, "Nothing ventured, nothing gained"? They did nothing and expect me to just go along with waiting until next year . . . AGAIN!
Irish u have to b so dizzy the way u r trying to spin the moves they made. It doesnt take rocket science to see they needed to add talent to this 5 WIN TEAM.
I am in no way happy about what they did in the draft... but to say they didn't add any talent is, well, ignorant at best.... They added Mingo (like him or not, many Scouts, GM's, analyst) have him listed as talent.... He can rush the passer, is he smallish? Yep.... can he add weight? Yep! The only thing about his game that I'm not thrilled about is I'm afraid he'll get run over in the run game, but only time will tell... McFadden also has talent... and I've read many different places, from many different analyst that he very well should be an upgrade of Skrine, and definitely could start opposite Haden... They also added a veteran WR, while not an all-star by any stretch, he has been a solid productive WR and we got him for basically nothing!!! Not to mention that the draft is only part of the off-season, they also Added Kruger, Bryant, and Nelson, not to mention Chud, Turner, and Horton... How can you possibly say they haven't added talent?
I will clarify JYD, they had the #111 pick and traded it and then went on the rest of the draft and picked an injured safety his whole career and 2 guys that will b lucky to make the practice squad. They could of added talent during these rounds and took fliers. I think we all saw what happened when Skrine started vs NYG and now they expect this other little guy to compete for a starting job.
Irish don?t get me wrong I DON?T want a new CEO/GM/HC every other year. I fully agree that the constant turnover at the top is and has been the biggest roadblock to the Browns having a winning organization. What I want is for the overall attitude in the organization to change from be patient we have to build it, to you know what we may not have all the pieces, but WE WILL WIN with what we have. I am not getting the impression that they want to win, but to just compete, maybe. All this it?s a process shtuff, be patient crap is tough to keep swallowing; especially when you hear players make comments such as? "It's a great organization and their only focus is: we want to win and we want to win now. That's obviously different than some of the things that I've been a part of the last few years." I want to hear that about the BROWNS, not other teams. Yes we all know it?s a process, but when does the seemingly eternal rebuilding process STOP and Winning begin? :/ Right now, today, I feel like they don?t want to stop rebuilding, or care if they ever do.
EVERY pick in the 6th and 7th rounds are "fliers"... in fact, what I've read, the guys they took have alot of talent.... but concerns (injury, off-the feild) but talent isn't really a concern of any of them... BTW Stopper... could you let me know what type of sure fire upgrades you would've found in the 6th and 7th rounds when the Browns were picking? What "talent" did they miss out on in the 6th and 7th rounds?
