No matter how you slice it, he took a team with some talent that went 5-11 in 2014 but has now gone 14-34 in three seasons (3-15 in NFC North) since. Some of our gripes include but are not limited to the following: traded Brandon Marshall for nothing let Alshon Jeffrey walk when WR was a massive need thought Mike Glennon was worth $18 million this year whiffed on every free agent brought in except for Akiem Hicks whiffed badly on his first 1st round pick with Kevin White cut Robbie Gould and replaced him with crap He's had some solid picks in the middle rounds but the roster is still full of holes and severely lacking in depth, after three years. That's on the GM.
Last I checked the point of defense is to not let the other team score. This season Pats were 5th in points allowed. 1st last year. 10th, 8th, and 10th the years before that under Patricia. Not sure finishing top 10 is average. And it definitely doesn’t suck.
Jim Schwartz is unacceptable. Not an option. Fangio was interviewed first, for the job. I don't know that an offensive head coach is necessary. A QB coach and OC that are capable of properly taking care of a young QB should be satisfactory, provided the HC doesn't get in the way. If the HC is getting in front of his OC to the team's detriment, then it doesn't matter whether he comes from a defensive background or not - he's a bad choice. Pace has done some good things, and has improved since he started (at least, that's what early returns show). But, he's made plenty of bad decisions and moves - moreso than I think is reasonable. I'm willing to give him another year, and see if he's able to continue that improvement/if his selections to this point fall apart or step up. I'm willing to give him one more year - not multiple. The problem is, if he proves he's not up to the task, the Bears have shown that they'll keep him around for the duration of his contract, or at least up to his last year. So we're stuck with him for a few more seasons, regardless.
Oy this one's going to take a while. I'm about 70-30 on Shaw right now. I like him, but I don't love him--but I'll offer an objective look. Getting a college coach is a lot harder than some fans think, myself included back after Trestman was hired when on this board I pined for then/now Michigan State HC Mike Dantonio (but don't really anymore, dude's too much of a hardass of a personality for an NFL lockerroom and now has some bad college sex offense crimes that have not made that program or team look good in handling. he should have gotten out 4 years ago when he could and be ahead of everything like Pete Carroll). Shaw's appealing. For those who don't watch college football, besides age/body limits its an entirely different game for coaches. They are royalty when they are there and winning. They recruit their own guys, they run their own offenses and defenses, and they build schemes that work, and many often do. And its diverse. Its exotic. You wont see half the teams run these things in the NFL, because speed and just elevated planning and play make many ineffective, though its certainly seeing its influences becoming heavier in playcalling on offenses and defenses, heavier in decades past. And I haven't began to scratch the surface in recruiting, which is getting to my point. In college, you can out recruit a team if you cant outscheme them. And you just can't do that in the NFL. And that's why Shaw is appealing, he took over a team when Jim Harbaugh, Fangio, coaches, and Andrew Luck left; and people predicted they would fall apart. This guy is taking middle of the road (3 star recruits) and a sprinkle of playmakers like a McCaffrey and a Bryce Love and they play like a well run team, capable of beating PAC 20 elites like the Washington Huskies, USC, UCLA, and some others. He's coaching to win, and he's had a few breaks too, the way any coach would. Its what you want in a coach. Oh, and he has 9 years coaching in the NFL as a WR coach, QB coach, and lower level assistants. That's something not a lot of college coaches have in their back pockets. Now to the next step in the equation: the nuts and bolts. Who's he bringing, what kinds of schemes, his vision for Trubisky, and other necessary aspects of the position. Many believe he's competent enough to achieve all three while bringing in great coaching and a foundation for development of a constant contender. He's shown he can hang tough in college. And now we get to the hard part. Does Shaw want to give what he has up? He's making a comfortable 4.1 mil per year and works in Palo Alto, living somewhere gorgeous in the bay. He's already part of the aggressive college circuit, and Stanford has made equally aggressive strides to keep him around, doubling his salary in 2016. If you want him as the coach of the bears, you not only have to convince a college coach who has it pretty fucking nice in Northern California. He runs the show, he recruits his guys, and he has the final say. He has to give that up for a significant lack of control now, because now he's not going to pick his roster, and he's got a bureaucracy that includes Ted Phillips and George McKaskey. And I just don't believe Ryan Pace will relinquish any kind of control, nor should he. That bit San Francisco in the ass with Harbaugh. San Fran accumulated so many picks that swung and missed, and that crippled them. And Stanford wants to keep this guy, so now he alone, without his own crew/team of assistants just became a hell of a price tag, and while I don't know his current contract status, if he has a buyout--then you got to pay Stanford on top of that. And then you get to his coaches. He's been rumored to want to be paired with former head coach/current DC from the Saints, Dennis Allen. And I'm really just turned off by that. I'm not blown away by the guy, he's needed an all pro rookie DB playing like an all-time great in Lattimore to make his defense better than what Rob Ryan had before him. I don't think he gets the most out of Leonard Floyd, or some young guys in the secondary. New Orleans in recent years I just remember being a shootout team because their defense was porous. I'm half empty on Allen, and I think he's a step above Mel Tucker. Long story short, he's a damn fine coach worth much of the praise he gets. He's absolutely worth an interview. Is it likely? Not for the Chicago bears. Too bureaucratic, and you're going to have to give him control and a lot of money to pry him from Palo Alto, California. Agree, he's a prick. He was far too undisciplined and he (and Wilks) both bring 4-3 defenses, and you can't afford to abandon what you've made so far with the 3-4. This team is closer to being a top defense with a few more pieces. I am. How he went out in Denver was just shitty. I don't trust a guy like that.
Did he turn down more lucrative offers for him? If he took what was offered then sometimes that is all you can get. A players worth isnt what fans think it is but what other teams are willing to give. If he got all that anyone was willing to give that is better than getting nothing. Yes he was allowed to walk and yes it was about the money sometimes you have to make that decision for a team. I cant fault a guy for not making him a higher offer than the eagles did. Yeah that one was a head scratcher from day 1 I dont think you will find anyone outside the Glennon family that thought this was a good move. Im not sure Sam Achoo and Prince Amukamara can be considered whiffs. Both men played a lot of snaps and with only signing them to 1 year contracts its not like your team is bound to them. Yes he did but its not like drafting is an exact science. White was listed high on several boards and was considered to be the WR with the highest upside. Yes he turned out to be fragile but there are no crystal balls telling you a guy is going to stay healthy or get hurt. I also highly doubt that he is the first person to have their overall number 1 draft pick not work out. I think Belichick first pick was a no one. Meh to replace an injured Susiham our team traded for a washed up kicker before we actually found a good one Kickers a fickle and again it probably was a money move sometimes those work out sometimes they don't. Not trying to be an ass just as an outsider looking in I think his moves have been more positive than negative but that is just one mans opinion.
Damn, we can all scratch Dowell Loaggins off the list of potential HCs. He was snatched up by Miami. I wanted him so bad. Haha
I'm with the rest of you on Schwartz. Turned a team that was already full of losers into a team of thug losers. He's a classless meathead. No thanks. I'm dismissive of your thoughts given that you're spoiled rotten with the Steelers, who haven't had a losing season in a decade or more. When you have a GM who goes 14-34 in a 3 year stretch (including 3-15 against the AFC North, imagine that!), you can come around here and let us know you're happy with your GM. Funny, if it wasn't for McDaniels, the Bears franchise would have a completely different historical timeline, think Back to the Future part 2. In fact, things might have been a lot better than they are. The guy came into Denver, refused to give a vote of confidence to Shitwad, and we all know what happened next. As far as how it ended for him in Denver, hopefully he was humbled and matured by the experience. Lots of guys when given a second NFL HC opportunity have had great success: Belichik, Coughlin, Carroll to name a few. McDaniels is an asshole, brash and unapologetic, but not a meathead. He's been part of a system that has succeeded for 15 years, even when Brady has been injured/suspended. I think he has something to offer as a HC, provided he has matured since Denver.
But here's where I don't know if you're being a troll like some putz from the browns board or that pats guy, or if you're serious and just don't follow the bears as closely as us old timers......but this is false. The bears did. They offered him 5 years at 13.5 mil per year with a lot of that guaranteed. The Eagles gave him 8 mil with roster bonuses that can take him to 14, but he's going to miss a few of those so he wont make more this year. Jeffery took a 1 year contract where he bet on himself, and is making less per year in his long term deal than what the bears offered him. And his contract extension? 4 years, 52 million, 27 guaranteed. Still less than what the bears offered him. The guy just didn't want to be here, but Pace wanted to keep him long term without burning 17+ mil per year with a franchise tag, and John Fox hated him and thought he was a prima donna. I'm not as jaded about the rest of your post, but. Yeah, try again with this one. Humbled and matured? His assistant under his directive was caught filming another team's practices against the 49ers in London and got fired that week and he tried to play stupid. I don't care for someone like that, and I've intensely skeptical of the Belichick coaching tree sans Bill O'Brien, who's not available. If we don't want Schwartz to turn this team into cheap-shotting, further undisciplined douches then this guy shouldn't be an alternative "because hopefully he was humbled and matured by the experience." And I'm not in this guy's corner--at all--because he's not a fit, but I'll play devil's advocate nonetheless. Why cant Schwartz be given the same benefit of the doubt? with maturity and humbling himself? Because we saw him for years as a rival and not so much McDaniels? You brought up the bears destiny and the shitwad trade. McDaniels rolled with Orton then Tebow. When he drafted Tebow, he said that "Tim has all the traits you want in a starting quarterback." Oops. Then he went back to Belichick's well-oiled machine. Eh. I'll give him Sitton, Unrein, and Trevathian. Prince too. I'll give him Zach Miller, who was signed to a reserves/futures contract in 2013 (and never played because he was hurt) that expired a month and change Pace was onto the job, and he gave him back to back extensions. Hell i hated the guy and I'll put Hoyer in here. But he has missed on a few. Glennon, Prosinski, Barf, Wheaton, McPhee, Rolle, Massie, Cooper, and I'm sure there's a couple of more. He gets an 'A' for effort because it was well documented he tried to get AJ Bouye and Stephon Gilmore. He hasn't missed big, so there's that. We aren't eating bad money like Julius Peppers at the end where we had to see them eat 18 mil for a year or two. He has to be better, and he's all in now, he cant come up to the podium the 15 minutes of the year he shows his face if the bears suck again and say "i'm excited for this team's future."
I would argue McDaniels has had greater success as an assistant than Schwartz as an assistant. Schwartz is an idiot. When he opens his mouth that much is clear. McDaniels was fired from Denver 7 years ago. A lot has changed since then, save for the fact that the Patriots offense continues to excel as they shuffle in/out players at every position except for QB. It can be argued that it's all Brady, and maybe it is, but maybe McDaniels is partly responsible for that success too. You are right to be skeptical of the Belichick tree. Charlie Weiss and Romeo Crennel were awful coaches. So was Eric Mangini. Maybe McDaniels hasn't changed. I'm not going to lose any sleep if we don't hire him. Maybe you have a thought on this but to me there are similarities with McDaniels and Lane Kiffin. Lane failed horribly at many places including the Raiders but I think he'll figure out eventually. He just had a good year at FAU and only a matter of time before he gets another shot at a big time school. Orton was fine, turned out he was better than Shitwad. The Tebow pick is unforgivable. I look at that as McDaniels being overconfident in himself in thinking he could make him an NFL QB. He failed epically. That's when I say hopefully he's been humbled and realizes that even he can't help a guy as bad as Tebow. The Sitton move negates his inexcusable release of Slauson. I'll give him Trevathan and Freeman, though their impact has been limited due to injuries and suspensions. Unrein and Prince try hard but aren't impact players and haven't upgraded their respective positions. Way more misses than hits.
Huh. Well that is surprising. Guess I should’ve checked some stats... Nevertheless, his success could potentially be taken with a grain of salt considering the offense. It’s the bizarro Bears.
There's no doubt having a great offense helps the defense. But Patricia has developed a lot of players and he's gotten results despite players coming and going. And he isn't just a defensive guy because he joined the Pats as an offensive coaching assistant and coached the OL and TEs before moving over to defense. The guy is young and he's extremely intelligent. Worth taking a look at.
Just quoted this bit but that was a very good read thanks pat. Seems unlikely then. Sounds like Shaw prob has a good deal for himself right now and to pry him away might take more commitment than the Bears are prepared to make.
Definitely not trolling but as an outsider I do not follow a your team as closely as my own of course. Now that you mentioned it I do remember the Bears making him an offer. The fact he turned it down IMHO makes it even less Pace's fault that he left. If he didnt want to be with the Bears as one of your fellow fans says what good would franchising him have done? Would he really be worth $15.682m (the cost to franchise a WR for 2017). He had 57 catches 789 yards and 9 touchdowns in one of the more prolific offenses this season do you really think with the bears he is putting up anything close to that? Are the bears a playoff team with Jeffery? A Super Bowl contender with Jeffery? The answer to both questions is probably no so again is he worth $15 million. The franchise tag would have made him the 3rd highest paid WR for the 2017 season ahead of AJ Green, Julio Jones, Keenan Allen, Dez Bryant and TY Hilton. All of whom had more receiving yards than Jeffery, all of them save for Hilton had more catches than Jeffery (they tied with 57). Now he did beat them all out with his 9 touchdowns but that is likely a product of being on a team that has multiple threats allowing him to get open looks in the red zone. Again in one of the better offenses this year he had 57 receptions good for 52nd in the nfl, and his 789 yards ranked 34th in the nfl is that worth $15 Million? You can be angry with Pace if you want but he made the right decision based on the fact bringing Jeffery back at that price was not going to win you a SB.
I don't think you understand, this isn't about what they got for him, although yes they didn't get enough in return and that should've nixed the deal. But the point is Marshall shouldn't have been near the trade block in the first place. One of the first rules of building a winning team is you don't let good talent out the door if you can help it. The Bears had a top 3-5WR tandem in the league when Pace got here. Now they have one of the worst in the NFL. That is all on the GM, he completely wrecked the position. Marshall btw went off for like 110catches 1500yards and 14TD's the very next season. Those are all-pro numbers. And if your interested, the real reason they traded him wasn't culture or any of that crap. Marshall and Cutler fell out big style. It became apparent one of em had to go and Pace absolutely made the wrong choice. This is plain false. The Bears offered more money than the Eagles did. And failing that they could, and probably should, have franchised him. A head scratcher. I guess that's one way to put it. Gross incompetence would be another. Acho has played so much simply cos of injuries. I actually like him cos he's a high effort guy, but he's nothing more than a 4th stringer and not a good example of a FA who's gonna make your team better. Prince has been solid. I'm of the personal opinion that he's not been quite as good as people suggest because he's been tested way way less than Fuller. He's actually like the 4th highest paid guy on the team this year. He has zero INT's. Zero fumbles. And 7 PDef's. So 1mil per PDef. I consider Trevathon a hit. But the point thats nothing compared to the long list of misses. Yes, we all want to build thru the draft, but you have to hit on some FA's too and Pace must honestly be batting around .150 right now. Pace has been a trainwreck in FA. White isn't just made of glass. His hands are bad and his route running is worse. But the real reason Pace deserves shit for White is because it was Pace himself who entirely created the circumstances for having to draft White. If Pace keeps Marshall he doesn't draft White. If Pace doesn't trade Marshall to the Jets(picking 1 slot before the Bears in the draft), WR is still enough of a need that the Jets in all likelyhood draft White themselves and the Bears then draft Leonard Williams, widely considered the top prospect that year. Through no one but his own complete fuckery Pace ended up with White and a 6th rounder, when he could've had Marshall and Leonard Williams. Just unspeakably bad GM work. Wow, NO! Gould may have had a more middling season the year prior, but he was still one of the best kickers in team history and one of the most accurate kickers in history. And he did all that kicking half the time at Soldier! As a fan of a team who themselves have very challenging conditions for kickers, i hope you can appreciate that. Furthermore they cut him right on the eve of the season with very little backup plan and a limited market. They had all offseason to look at this and did nothing. They didn't even bring another leg into camp. They never once spoke to Gould about taking a paycut either. The whole thing was completely disorganized. Since then Gould has been outstanding and the Bears a complete mess at the position. Another huge problem created solely and needlessly by the GM. And if any of that doesn't change your mind then quite simply, in a results orientated business, Pace is 14-34 in 3 years. Not good enough and anyone who thinks it is, is full of shit.
He's not a troll pat. He just doesn't follow the team as closely. But its interesting to see another teams fan speak about Pace. I suspect its very easy to be ok with something like a 14-34 record when its not your team.
You are right that it wasn't an easy decision with Jeffery. The Bears were in a tough spot. But.... they had just invested a ton in the QB and HAD to give him weapons. They also had a ton of CAP space, Jeffery really wouldn't have hurt the team financially. It wasn't a no brainer, but Jeffery should've been retained i feel. For Trubisky if nothing else. Cos most the guys he was throwing to this year shouldn't have been in the league.
Hopefully Meredith will return healthy next season for you and can be the #1 they were hoping he could be this year. They can probably resign Inman cheap and while his over all bears impact wasnt great his first three games prove he can be productive. If he is on the field as a #2 or #3 he can be effective for the bears. Sorry about wheaton I think most Steelers fans would have told Pace NO!!!! had he asked them.
