MLB - NEWS & NOTES

i hate the WAR stat. I'm a triple crown category guy. guess im old school. or just old.

 

come on, cat! WAR is the bestest stat EVAR. i mean, look at the tigers this year. we're obviously talking about an all-time great team there, and their WAR backs it up.

%) *CRAZY* %)

 

I'm a slash line guy.

 

I think WAR told us last year that Lester had a higher WAR than Cespedes. LOL.

 

war smore. i hate the sabermetrics crap. im old school. for over 100 yrs baseball didnt use sabermetrics and was just fine. was ruth judged by sabermetrics? no. he just batted .340 50+ hrs and 140+ rbis and call it a day.

 

And now Mr. Avila, the new GM with the Tigers wants to convert to sabermetrics.

 

i know they want the phils new gm whenever amaro is fired to be a analytics guy.

like i posted before a scout once said sabermetrics cant see a live player in front of you. can't see his strengths or weaknesses. can't see if he dips his swing or has a loop in it. on the human eye can see it not sabermetrics.

he's right!

i was at a AA game in Tennessee once and sitting next to a scout for the Rockies. He had a radar gun and a notepad taking notes on this pitcher. sabermetrics can't see what he sees.

in that game saw 2 future major leaguers dee gordon and scott van slyke.

 

cat, just in case the sarcasm was missed, i'll spell out my position.

not only do i not like WAR, i'll take it a step farther. please don't call it a stat, because it's not a stat. it's a subjective formula and it's no more an actual stat than quarterback rating is.

 

WAR... what is it good for (good god y'all)... absolutely nothing.

 

say it again

 

Huh yeah

 

lulz= i saw the funny faces. my best friend who is a huge baseball guy is a firm believer in WAR. he argue all the time. i hate it with a passion and he knows how passionate i can be.

give me a player at face value of seeing him live is all i need. im old school so i know im in the minority here.

 

if you're in the minority, so am i.

 

If you have a fairly good WAR okay you are good but you don't need WAR to tell you that. I'm all for using stats to help you but some stats are misleading and others are like this subjective piece.

 

Stats arnt a bad thing in my opinion, it's how there used. Stats must exist, and when in proper context, paint a cool picture, but some people and their over analyzing of every little thing and trying to encapsulate everything into an equation, bug me.

'The computer says'...

 

the thing is, we're not talking about a stat. we're talking about WAR, which is an opinion. now i am sure some people consider it a valid opinion, but it's still just an opinion.

the fact that there are several different formulas for calculating WAR should tell u everything u need to know about it not being a statistic. at the end of the year, people can still debate what a player's WAR was.

number of home runs is like number of people in a city. it's a statistic.

WAR is like number of jerks in a city. it's an opinion.

 

That was very well said. I wished i would have said it meself.

Honestly, i dont even know what war is or even how to use it. I never got into that sorta thing.

 

At least passer rating makes a little bit of since. It equally weighs 4 things, TD%, INT%, completion% any yards/attempt. WAR claims to be an all encompassing stat that takes everything into account in a weigh no one can explain.

Not saying passer rating is great, but at least you can see the thought idea behind it. WAR is significantly worse.

 

Another thing I want to point out is how people that use WAR talk about sabermetics. SABR, the Society of American Baseball Researchers, decided if they could find new and unique ways to analyze baseball. Originally that's a great goal, finding new and creative ways to look at things isn't a bad thing. They started with pretty simple things like OBP, which I think we all agree has value. How often a guy gets on base is simple, factual, and useful. It's better to get on base than make an out. Then they thought, which is more important, getting on base or driving extra base hits? That's a valid question, so they decided to add OBP and SLG% together to make OPS (on-base + slugging), thinking it could combine the 2 in a way to value different types of hitters against each other.

Another thing that was done was to try to see if "clutch" was real, or just luck. They were the first ones to look at things like RISP (runners in scoring position) numbers, as well as hitting numbers in the 7th inning or later.

Where it all goes wrong is when people apply them incorrectly. Even Bill James, who originated advanced metrics, has talked about how if all you use is those metrics then you miss some things. He has talked about how important it is to only use stats that exactly measurable, and isn't a huge fan of WAR other than as a general barometer for measuring specific things.

My point is, sabermetrics aren't evil, they're very intelligent applications to baseball. Their entire purpose is to take a new look at the game and not just assume what we had was best, or take someone's word that those stats are best. The issue now is that people take these new numbers and simply assume they are better because someone tried to create something better. Many people use these stats and don't truly understand them, and those people are doing exactly what the creators of sabermetrics were trying to avoid. Those who do understand them understand that they are not perfect, and following them blindly is over simplifying the game.

Long story short, sabermetrics aren't stupid, stupid people are stupid.

 

is that what a passer rating is? i stopped paying attention. passer rating, QBR, WAR...

i don't doubt WAR is worse. i love the concept of a stat that several groups define differently %)