Okay, prove me wrong. Can you show me one person who has an issue with the anthem protests who previously complained about any of those other things beforehand? Since you're certain I'm simply making assumptions, this shouldn't be too difficult. Also, I never made an assumption. I specifically said "I've never heard...". But since you'll prove that it's happened shortly, I'm sure I'll update my outlook on that behind your proof Also, your comparison is weak, for the record. "I have a black friend" was usually a lie a racist made to defend their racism. It's actually fairly easy to research the very high number of veterans that support a player's right to protest. Veterans, at worst, seem to be split on this. And it was veterans who specifically said to kneel. How that is the same as "I have a solitary black friend" to you is interesting.
FINALLY!!! Someone else sees this bullshit parade for what it truly is. That’s why it’s ok to buy a beer/hat/etc. during the demo. It’s not about America’s wars or the future/current/past service members. KA-CHING! “Keep your hands off my stack.” - Roger Waters
I can't speak for every stadium, but I was just at the Indians/Astros game and happened to be in line at the vendors when the anthem came on...everyone in the complex stopped what they were doing. Nothing was sold at that particular venue during the anthem. I can't speak for the whole stadium as we were inside in the club seats, but basically everything stopped. People who were eating stopped and stood, all hats were removed, etc... I was pleasantly surprised. For the guy taking a shit, was it before or after they announced they were starting that he started pushing? Once inside the restroom, it's hard to even know it's going on....just sayin'
I think a lot of you are missing the point on the pregame ceremonies that the NFL "allows" the military to do. You paint it like the NFL is trying to turn a profit while attempting to fleece the public on their patriotism. That isn't it in the least.. A) The national anthem is a tried and true tradition dating back hundreds of years...In this country and every country around the world. It is a respect to national pride and a time to honor those who have given us freedoms. B) The rest of the pregame show is PAID by the military, BECAUSE they use it as propaganda for soliciting new volunteers. This has been something the government has been doing since before the World Wars took place. Just one more reason this is the greatest country in the world, the government does no force us to be in the military. We have the citizens that step up and volunteer to do so. How do you think this continues to be? Do you think if the government stopped advertising that new volunteers would just show up? These "bullshit parades" as you eloquently put it, are a major campaign effort to keep the Armed Forces filled with volunteers. Without them, YOU may be forced to put in a couple years of service like other nations are forced to do. C) The NFL doesn't MAKE MONEY on these, the armed services are paying for personnel needed to put on the spectacle. Do you have any idea what goes into organizing such a display? It doesn't happen for free. The military is happy to pay for these, because they get to participate in events that draws thousands and thousands of people in one place, as well as free TV air time reaching millions more.
lol the guy taking a shit was just an extreme example. If everyone around you was doing that, then no problem. I've just noticed, again from my experiences, that people don't seem to be as overall angry about all the random activities that go on during the anthem compared to how angry they are about one particular action (kneeling).
I don't know R_#1, I've been going to live sports events since the 70's and honestly, other than the ignorant few here and there, I don't notice it happening like you apparently do. I know every event I go to in Cleveland, the walking vendors stop during the anthem and nothing is being sold...It's been the same at Indians, Browns and Cavs games I have attended. I've always thought it was a rule that they stop when the anthem was played, maybe it isn't.
Definitely a difference then. I've been to stadiums in Baltimore, Tennessee, and Atlanta for football games, Baltimore and New Jersey for baseball games, and Atlanta for a soccer game. Not one stopped selling snacks during the anthem, although I must point out that I can't confirm the soccer one as everyone I was with was at their seats. Baltimore and Atlanta I've been to multiple games for and have been late, so I witnessed those myself. Tennessee, one of the people I was with was getting snacks at that time. Hmm, in retrospect I can't confirm what happened in Jersey either, but I do recall people buying beer during the anthem. Can't say what the concession stands did or didn't do. EDIT: Also been to DC and Atlanta for basketball games. Can confirm they didn't stop sales at either event
This is all bs, the kneeling during the Anthem is a premeditated act. All the other stuff you guys are listing is stuff you shouldn’t be doing during the Anthem but wasn’t planned out before the game. Plus the people doing the protest are paid employees. If I took a knee in protest for anything while at my job (no matter how good the cause) I would be fired.
Being honest, I've never not been in my seats at the Cavs games, so I really shouldn't state anything as fact for the hallway vendors there. I have seen walking vendors sit down their product for the National Anthem though.
This is the biggest hangup I have had through it all... If your EMPLOYER says no protesting while on the job, then that's the end of it. If you are protesting on your own time, then no one ANYWHERE should be able to tell you what to do, unless you are doing it illegally. This is a place of business and you are on the clock. Your employer most definitely has the right to say you can't do that on their dime.
I will tell you myself and about 100 men I've served with. I've always complained about the lack of respect, be it a fan not taking his hat off or yes the camera men panning around. Set the camera, stand and show respect. Is it that hard? I don't put money before patriotism. Many people complain, but to be honest they don't complain to people who think it's ok. It won't change. There are so many people in this country who sit back and shake their heads at what is going on and the direction this country has taken over the last 30 years.
The anthem wasn’t played at a stadium until around WW1. Then a few years later, a patriotic team owner started doing it on the regular, then it caught on. This rinky-dink ballpark parade has been happening less than a hundred years. Next year (I think) will be the 100 year marker. Google is your friend. I’m on my phone and at work otherwise I’d post the “ballpark parade history” for you guys.
As for a player walk out as has been reported... That would be the worst thing they could do. THAT would come back on them and the league would get sympathy for the act, imho. If it's a planned protest, then anyone that participates will get a fine and a suspension for missing work not injury related and they can be placed on the non-injury reserve list and allow teams to sign replacements. I don't care if it's bad football, I don't think enough players would miss THEIR money in order to carry it out...even if it meant missing a game to make the point to the players that they don't run the league, to me it would also prove that point. Players have been too entitled, not just in the NFL but all the leagues. The NBA is the worst, but the NFL is a close second.
What is your point fire?... The country didn't exist 250 years ago. Who cares how long the ceremony has been going on? Well besides you.
The National Anthem was played in the 1918 World Series, then it became tradition in the Olympics in 1924 for all nations. The Romans played an anthem before the opening of each gladiator gathering. It's tradition...The NFL adopted the practice in 1945. You are merely scratching the surface of professional sports in the United States....
The NFL, prior to this year, allowed that. People shouldn't keep making the "if I did x,y,z at my job argument". If your job allows it then it allows it. Prior to May of 2018, every player that took a knee was allowed to by their employer (with exceptions like in Dallas)
Well, since you're now telling me that you complained about all that beforehand, then I'll rescind my previous stance to I "know of" (since I don't actually know you, one person who's complained about that. I've never served (my respects to you) but I have many fans that have and all but two that I can think of support the protests (one of the two has never stated an opinion, the other is firmly against it). The comment about people shaking their head at this countries direction is on the same level of people, as you said, who think this should be a communist country. All allowed their opinion I guess
There is a difference between allowing it and having a rule against it. There was no rule, therefore the ultimate voice of the league really had no say. Each individual team did and each team handled it in a different manner. Some outright allowed it, some called for an alternative solution, some kept their team off the field altogether, which was the case prior to 2009 in the NFL to begin with. The league has a right to vote on league wide rules for really anything pertaining to game day. That's what they did, and regardless of whether the players like it or not, legally, there isn't anything they can do about it. They can continue to protest, and now be reprimanded for it...they can do a group protest and not even show up on game day and see where that gets them...If Kaep can't find a backup role anywhere, a complete walkout could be even worse.
Let's not lose site of the message...The LEAGUE is not under scrutiny for misconduct, they are not what the players are protesting...yet... IF they did this walk out, then it becomes a personal protest against the league and that could have different ramifications for the players and how the fans perceive the league and player association as a whole. This is moving away from the focus of the original protest and putting the league in a light of being anti-protest. I personally don't see it that way...like ANY business, no smart business man would want their business to isolate any group. That is what protests do, they isolate a group, good bad or indifferent, that is what they do. As a business it isn't smart to allow protesting of any type on business grounds. If this protest is allowed, ANY PLAYER can decide to protest for their own reason. What if a group of players got together and decided to protest monogamy? Maybe they don't like that the country doesn't allow marriages of multiple partners due to their own religious beliefs. They won't be on a soap box prior to the game, but social media will show the "why" and it would become a national story...would you feel as strongly about bringing THAT issue to light on the football stage? Or would you feel that football really isn't the time or place to discuss it?
