Scrubs? What else did he have to work with? They did hold his Pro Day at Notre Dame, right? (that bang you just heard was Irish's head exploding :-/ )
Tony Grossi only three months late to the party. Welcome to the Official Cody Kessler Fan Club, friend! [twitter=https://twitter.com/ESPNCleveland/status/844914990742192128][/twitter]
Don't know that I would want to publically admit that I agree with Tony Grossi. The guy is an ass kissing idiot.
And hasnt been right on QBs in yrs....he was the biggest Hoyer backer ever.....he must feel Kessler is the next Hoyer....he culd b right....journeyman backup
Well unfortunately we just don't really know about Cody Kessler, other than he kills it with the eastern European supermodels. The two concussions have always been my main reason for being adamant about getting a QB. Our running game was rolling. The QB has GOT to be able to stay on the field....I watched every Browns game last year, and then re-watched, because I'm that kind of sick....Given the circumstances, Kessler was impressive IMO. He didn't light it up, but he didn't embarrass himself either. The kid showed some ability, without question...I've always wanted Kessler in the picture, but there's no way to be convinced he's the man. We will find out soon how hard he's been working.... He just might take over in 2017....He's the kind of player, only a fool would count out. If he "wants it" the job is there. Brady is the obvious example of a guy nobody saw coming, but you just never know how bad a guy "wants it"... We just need a QB to step up, and take control of this football team...I know this much, if Kessler does become the man, the Browns FO will look brilliant for the way they handled the 2016 draft... The dude already has a girl comparable to Brady's....I'm givin him that. @=
Evidently the ND QB stepped up his game today boys! Geez...Now McShay is all about Kizer...Evidently his ceiling now is higher than any QB that has ever played.... (slight exaggeration....but not much) IDK fellas....I just want a solid NFL prospect, and I agree with all that it would be ideal if he fell in our lap....Unfortunately, I think the guy is Trubisky, and I think we'll have to move ahead of the Jets to get him....Likely trade partner; Jaguars or Titans. I just hope we can really get it done for #12 & #52, as I've heard speculated....Personally, that doesn't seem realistic to me for a jump into the top 5....Maybe that plus a future #2? IDK...I just know I don't want to see them part with two #1's, as I've also heard speculated on the high end of the spectrum... The bum on the street is sayin Trubisky is gonna be our guy....
Does the fact that every time one of these QB prospects has a good day, throw, interview, etc. it skyrockets his stock until the next guy does something... should that actually confirm the fact that no one really thinks any of these guys are the right option? Kizer was relegated to the third round after the Combine. Dead-eyes in interviews, didn't have passion for the game, couldn't make any throws. Now, after his Pro Day the sky's the limit for him. I still maintain that if we take a QB, I won't shake my fists at it, so long as we're not giving up either a better player or a better draft pick to do so.
EDIT: Fixed duplicate Twitter link. [twitter=https://twitter.com/RapSheet/status/845265283635974144][/twitter] [twitter=https://twitter.com/RapSheet/status/845264413837987840][/twitter] So Hue was working out Mahomes and Kizer during the Clemson and North Carolina Pro Days.
I'm still trying to figure out what you see in Trubisky to want to trade assets to move up to get him. On top of not being able to beat out Marquise Williams, there most likely is a really good explanation...Williams is a better QB. With essentially the same exact team, Williams took the Tar heels to a 11-3 record, including playing in the conference championship...They averaged 40.7 [del]yards[/del] points per game The next year, Trubisky takes over, against basically the same exact team, only lost 6 players, none of which were one of the 256 players drafted in the 2016 draft. He used those same assets to amass 32.3 points per game and guided that Tar Heels squad to a 8-5 record. I just cannot see what all the muss and fuss is about this kid, other than he is from Mentor...and I know it isn't just you, it's the national media. But I just think they are looking for someone, anyone, to be "the QB" of the 2017 draft class and he was artificially elevated in what he has shown. My rankings haven't changed for my top two, Deshaun Watson and DeShone Kizer, then everyone else..I can't take everything I have seen the past several months and simply change my mind based on what the media is saying.
U like to look at prototype QB and think oh my Kizer is 6'4 whatever...he was benched to a guy that isn't even on the team...he has trouble reading defenses in college...what will happen in the NFL...if your talking bout records...ND sure went backwards w the talent they had compared to the previous yr...Watson is a system QB that's my negative w him along w throwing INTs...Trubisky is the best QB in this draft IMO
Not trying to stir the pot, but if you apply that same logic to DeShone Kizer... Couldn't beat out Everett Gholson or Malik Zaire. Got the job in 2015 due to injury to Zaire. Had to compete with him for the job in 2016 and only "won" it after he had a terrific game against Texas In 2015, went 10-3 and the team averaged 34.2 PPG. In 2016, went 4-8, was benched, and the team averaged 30.9 PPG. They graduated a good tackle, a guard, a deep-threat wide receiver, and a running back. Furthermore, Kizer played only two ranked teams in 2016 (both losses). He completed 53.6% of his passes, threw 4 TDs to 2 INTs, and 564 yards. Trubisky played five ranked teams (2-3 record) in 2016. Completed 63.3% of his throws, threw 7 TDs to 4 INTs, and 1,198 yards. Note: One of those games was against Virginia Tech in an actual hurricane. Removing that (I know we can't), his numbers jump to 68.1% completion, 1,140 yards, 7 TDs and 2 INTs (2-2 record).
Gotta go with stopper on this one. If overall team performance (e.g., wins and losses) was the deciding factor, Colt McCoy would have been the best NFL QB of all time. Kizer looks like Tarzan and plays like Jane. He regressed in college, despite an easier schedule, and has not impressed in interviews according to every report but one (from a guy who conspicuously shares an agent). If we want to have the Trubisky/Watson debate, that one does have merit. Trubisky/Kizer? That's like comparing anyone to Blaine Gabbert.
Now, all that said... I'm still not on-board with a trade up to get any of these quarterbacks at the top of the first round. I do believe the Browns could have their pick of them at #12 and I will understand if they take one there. I would prefer they only do that if better talent is off the board, though. O.J. Howard with my guy would be better than Watson/Trubisky and Barnidge. #TeamCody
Well, for what it's worth, I said right from the beginning that we amateurs have no way to put true value on these QB's. We don't get to interview them. We don't get ANY sense of how much they love the game, or how hard they would work...It's just impossible. We can only rely on what we read, and what we see on the screen... That said, you may be right about that part I bolded Irish...Idk...after everything has been assessed, IMO Trubisky is the best prospect...Whether or not we should trade up for him, is completely impossible for us to determine....My theory is the Jets love Trubisky and so do the Browns. So that's how I came to the deduction that we'd need to move ahead of the #6 pick...Based on what I know, I could never say for sure if a trade up is necessary. It was more of a prediction, than a declaration that it's the way I want things to fall on draft day...
Woah, let's pump the brakes...I don't want Kizer at #12 either, let alone trade up for him...I am talking about the issue of trading up for Trubisky. As for Kizer, I agree he digressed a great deal, which is why his stock has dropped. Despite that, he showed more in 2015 than any of the QBs in this class did overall. So you still have the game film of him performing, the reasons why he digressed is what you need to dive deep in to find. Trubisky didn't digress, he simply didn't perform to as high a standard as another QB did with the same exact tools. A different issue...the fact that he could not win at the same pace is what I was talking about... In the case of Kizer, he DID lose a lot of tools to the NFL: Ronnie Stanley #6 overall Will Fuller #21 overall Jaylon Smith #34 overall Nick Martin #50 overall KeiVarae Russell #74 overall C.J. Prosise #90 overall Sheldon Day #103 overall So, it could easily be the fact he lost 40% of his starting offensive line, his #1 receiving target(Fuller accounted for 1,258 yards and 14 TDs. His replacement in 2016 had 961 yards and 9 TDs) and #1 weapon overall in RB Prosise(accounting for 1,300 total yards and 12 TDs. His replacement in 2016 had total 1,000 yards and 6 TDs), as to his point reduction of 3 points per game.. Trubisky lost 7 points per game, and didn't lose a single NFL caliber player from year to year. I'm not making excuses for Kizer, I will once again state, I don't want him at #12...I am merely making the case that the two regressions are not similar in any way shape or form... One regressed while losing more than 50% of their offense to the NFL. The other regressed using the same exact weapons as the previous QB did.
I can appreciate statistics as much as anyone. There are MANY valid points that say we should go BPA at #12, and forget QB....IMO, Problem with that is, who the hell knows how valuable the QB prospect is? It's IMPOSSIBLE to say who the "best player available" is...All I know is, if your team doesn't have a QB, you need to put MAXIMUM effort to change that....THE "BPA" might be the QB prospect by a mile.... Gotta have a QUARTERBACK.... OJ Howard seems like a "no brainer" at #12, and I would endorse that ALL DAY if we had a QB....and I'd say the same for Corey Davis...
Come to find out, The Browns actually DO have a QB signed to a contract presently...What they don't have is a roster around him...They have gotten a jump start in free agency, now if they use those draft picks wisely, there just might be a "team" for a QB to thrive in. Without that "team" no QB is ever going to succeed. I know none of us know who is going to succeed and who isn't. I don't disagree with that. However, you do your due diligence for a reason, when that information points in a direction other than QB, you don't ignore it simply because you don't have Peyton Manning on your team.
Big difference here... DeShone Kizer regressed personally in his second season as a starter after losing some weapons. The North Carolina Tarheels football program regressed in 2016 from an offensive production standpoint. Could be that they were starting a new quarterback and moving from a guy who rushed for almost 1,000 yards to more of a quick rhythm passer who wasn't asked to carry a team with his legs. Could be that they had a great deal of success in 2015 (11 - 3) playing against only three Top 25 teams and had to play five Top 25 teams in 2016. That said, I think we agree that we - at least you and I - would personally prefer not to trade up for any QB in this draft. I would also prefer not to trade anything for an existing QB (Garfloppolo?). Let the draft come to them and start adding pieces - or move aggressively to get a blue chip player who can start immediately (e.g., Malik Hooker or O.J. Howard).
