I'm right there with you TD, I'll love whichever one puts a trophy in the case, and that's W I N ! I also agree that Hoyer has to continue to play well and win, or he's a goner. I think he must know that too. Talk about pressure. That's why they pay the big bucks, so do you have a "set" Brian? Either way he's auditioning for a starting role. Irish, your point about the "situation" that will arise "if" Hoyer continues to play well is a great problem to have. I think, but it also could leave us never really getting a handle on what Johnny has to offer the NFL, and he's the only one who's a Brown next year, so I also understand the angst. I suspect it will play itself out, but honestly, thses things never come out black and white. I would bet that when the window opens for Manziel his performance will be a mixed bag, leaving us wondering if we have a franchise guy or not. Then Pettine & Co. will have unenviable task of making a call without definitive information. If Johnny gets his shot because Hoyer falters, then Hoyer is gone at season's end, almost by default, even though I'd love to keep him as a backup in that scenario, but I suspect someone will ante up and give him either a starters job or a camp competition with the chance to start. Speaking of "game managers", how do we evaluate Smith in KC? ESPN asked the question, which of the two SF QBs is dong a better job right now. Another "yes, but" argument, that looks at skill set vs winning football. Oh God!!!
Browns wide receiver Josh Gordon estimates that he's taken about 180 drug tests since his first season in the NFL in 2012. Gordon's taken so many drug tests during his 26 months in the league that he flat-out calls it 'harassing.' "It's definitely harassing for sure," Gordon told ESPN the Magazine. "You're, like, on probation." The 23-year-old receiver might be facing drug tests every week, but that doesn't mean he has a drug problem. Gordon said he hasn't done drugs since he signed with the Browns and that he's not addicted to anything. "Definitely not," Gordon said of having a drug problem. "I wouldn't know what I was addicted to because I don't do anything." Doctors at Cliffside Malibu, a five-star luxury rehab facility in California, seem to back up Gordon's claims. Back in mid-September, Gordon said they told him he didn't have a problem. "They made their diagnosis and said I wasn't addicted to anything, and I didn't have any drug problems," Gordon said. If you're wondering what Gordon did while he was in rehab, here's a small list: He did music therapy, acupuncture and he was even assigned a horse that he was responsible for feeding. "It's definitely some hippie s---," Gordon said of his time in rehab. "People there definitely had heavier problems than anything I've done. [The media] want to create this monster. Every story about me seems so harsh. 'He's an addict, a junkie, a cokehead.' That's not who you really are." If Gordon passes every drug test he's given, then he'll be back on the field for Cleveland in November. The Browns receiver is in the middle of a 10-game suspension that ends on Nov. 17.
He doesn't have a pot problem? This suspension could of cost him over $4 million dollars! So then I guess I was right about this dude! Not very intelligent.
Els, you are right. Looking at his quotes, he's choosing his words, and saying "I'm not addicted to anything", "I don't have a problem". Neither statement says I don't smoke a bone occasionally, and he probably does. It's not a problem if you work anywhere else, but it is one if you are looking to make the NFL your career. Not that I agree in any way with the NFL's policy on this since it isn't a performance drug, but those are the rules, and thus "the problem". Face it Josh, No smoking a bone now and then isn't a personal problem, but jepeordizing your career for it is. Wise up
Well Ken, to address your point that none of THAT statement said he doesn't smoke a bone...this excerpt left out the part where he said he hasn't touched a drug since college, but that he feels he entered the NFL in stage 2 of these the drug program because of young Myer mistakes made in college. THAT is when he went on to sayhe estimated he had taken over 180 tests since entering the league. He also went on to say he doesn't know anyone outside of football who doesn't smoke, so it is very difficult to do ANYTHING without coming in contact inadvertently. We are talking about giving up your entire life to ensure you are a mile away from someone else's choices... including his family. That isn't easy to do for anyone. 180 tests passed with one failed at the single closest possible way...and you guys want to agree he has a drug problem?
Irish, I stand corrected on mis representing his statements. More to the point, what I was trying to say, rather poorly I guess: is he has a drug problem "only in as much as the NFL has made it one. In other words I believe Josh is neither addicted nor has a substance abuse issue, but like many people around the world, he and or people around him enjoy MJ occasionally, and by being a part of it, he places himself in jeopardy (a problem). I can clearly see why he would feel like he is being persecuted for something that is "no big deal" in nearly every walk of life, as long as it doesn't impact job performance. The NFL sees it differently, for reasons that are "archaic" IMO. I think he is right , but it isn't personal, it's the conditions of his employer, so he has to accept it or find another NFL to work for. That part sucks, but it is the reality, so that part is where the problem is. I'd like to understand why Marijuana is even tested for. I just don't see the connection to it's impact on the game. As an employer, I can see having the right to dismiss an employee who's performance or behavior reflects negatively on the business, but without some overt evidence of behavior ( like driving under the influence, domestic violence), simply smoking a bowl doesn't impact the co. in any way IMO. After so many tests, if Josh was addicted, or a habitual user, it would have surfaced, and since that hasn't surfaced, then I find myself wondering what the purpose of his suspension is. I just don't get it.
Cleveland at Tennessee Sunday, Oct. 5, 1 p.m. ET (CBS) Why To Watch: The Browns could be poised to make a power move in the AFC. We've seen teams flirt with showing a sign of being a potential factor, like the Dolphins and Bills, only to take a poor turn. After some heartbreaking losses (all of Cleveland's games have come down to the final play) and now coming off a bye, I expect this team to go on a run. Pittsburgh's stumbles have created an opportunity to make a jump within their division as well, and the Titans have been nothing short of putrid since Week 1. I'm not sure that's going to change anytime soon. They're getting beat up all over the field and don't seem to be all that tremendously torn up about it. Ken Whisenhunt has a total rebuild on his hands, and I get the sense that reality is just starting to seep in. Cleveland is scoring plenty of points despite being short on proven offensive talent and I don't think that changes anytime soon. And after this the Browns get the Steelers (who they nearly beat in Pittsburgh in Week 1 and against whom they rallied from 24 points down), the Jags, the Raiders and the Bucs, three of those four at home. Keep the faith, Dawg Pound. NFL WEEK 5Browns-Titans preview What To Watch For: People still talk about the Browns as being such a stout defense, and they made major strides in recent years, but the defense has let them down a bunch already. If not for a tendency to allow big plays late, this team could easily be 3-0. The Browns are allowing 26 points a game, which is troubling, and have allowed 19 plays of 20 yards or more through just three games (only Jacksonville has allowed more per game). ... I'd figure the Titans try to feed rookie Bishop Sankey the ball, as he has started to show some flicker of a spark. The Browns have been poor against the run, allowing 5.2 yards per carry, second worst in the league. ... Lot of chemistry going on between Hawkins and Browns quarterback Brian Hoyer ... Should be the first we really see of Browns tight end Jordan Cameron with him now truly feeling better after the bye. Look for him early and often. ... The Browns are very hopeful of getting a big day from Ben Tate in his return from injury; they need him in pass protection. ... Hoyer hasn't thrown an interception in five games. ... Charlie Whitehurst looked OK last week in a spot start, and Jake Locker's status for this game is still in doubt.
Maybe because it illegal in 48 of the 50 states? Before you all call me an crotchety old man who is out of touch with society . . . I personally couldn't care less if someone wants to toke their life away. But I fail to see the logic in the NFL condoning something - anything - that is against the law. Isn't that exactly what got them into the PR hell storm surrounding Ray Rice, Adrian Peterson, et al? And no, I'm not comparing domestic violence and/or child abuse to smoking pot. But the fact is they are all illegal (except for MJ in two states).
Here's an honest question from a marijuana illiterate. Is a marijuana "high" close to being drunk in that it slows the reflexes and/or thought process? If so, could it be that that the NFL doesn't believe that MJ enhances performance but rather reduces it?
Yes, but that would be a terrible hypothesis basing it on Gordon..(even though I don't believe he is a pothead) If this were the case, why would a suspected pot head be the 3rd highest yardage gainer in the history of the league only beaten by Randy Moss and Jerry Rice to begin his career? Maybe a "true" pot head suffers, but same as alcohol, the effects wear off rather quickly for occasional "social smokers".
Now taking this a step further, being in stage three (as of now for the rest of his career) these athletes are subject to up to 10 random drug tests per month. Gordon used the word harassment, and honestly I would have to agree with him. If these players reach this stage, maybe it would be better to offer a second option, either a random test up to 10 times per month as it is now, or a set drug test each week Monday Wednesday AND Friday mornings. This would allow for more tests than the 10, but it would also offer structure to the player that he otherwise does not have. Now if they are taking tests every two days (except weekends) there is a minute chance of them being able to pass a test if they back slide in their use of drugs and/or alcohol. However, at least they won't be taken advantage of in their every day lives the way Gordon has. I mean, really, he leaves the dock on a boat and they have to turn around immediately to get to a drug test within two hours...That is harassment in my book for a guy who had passed atleast 179 of 180 drug tests in his time in the NFL, with that lone test being 1 billionth of a gram over, and a second sample of the same urine being under the alotted amount. Sorry, but I think that is inhumane punishment that would be more likely to push a great athlete into darkness than any other outside influence. Take a minute to absorb his life since entering the league...Could ANY of you handle this type of scrutiny on a daily basis? I really don't think I could, honestly.
Lym, I get your point, but counter with: let the law handle it. As for performance, well if your point is it's like alchohol, then are we testing for drinking a few beers too? IMO the only defense is that it is outside the rules, period. Now a discussion about the rules.............. This is my point, things that are illegal, should be handled by the law. The NFL has every right to protect it's brand by imposing behavior policies, but if they treating drug use beyond the law's treatment, and it based on use, not behavior that results from use, I think they are pointing their guns in the wrong direction. If someone uses drugs or alchohol, and subsequently gets involved in an accident, gets into a brawl, commits domestic abuse, etc.... then the behavior following the substance use is the issue, and should be punished. Incidentally in law enforcement, most of the time Marijuana users, not sellers, are treated pretty softly, not removed from their job, or locked up. Repeat offenders are a different matter, and most often it's their behavior following the use that lands them in hot water and the drug use law is the easiest law to apply. IMO the NFL should and does regulate and punish performance enhancing substances, which makes prefect sense. Recreational alchohol and marijuana use doesn't fall under that umbrella, and is only impactful on the NFL when it results in behaviors that tarnish the brand. That's how I feel about it. I know three are differing opinions.
BEREA, Ohio?Mike Pettine said the Browns will continue to use Travis Benjamin as the primary punt returner despite averaging just 0.7 yards a return. Benjamin has three returns for just two yards. He also has five fair catches. Pettine said it?s too early to pull the plug on Benjamin. ?No, I think that we can be very situational with our punt returners. We haven?t given up on Travis,? Pettine said. ?We want to see him kind of get it back and get going again.? Pettine was asked if Benjamin has been slowed by his recovery from the ACL injury he sustained last season. ?I think it?s just too small of a sample size at this point because in his reps on offense, that hasn?t shown,? Pettine said. ?He?s playing very well. I think just about every week he?s gotten behind the opponents secondary, so I don?t know if I would say the knee is necessarily a big factor there. I think it?s just too early to panic in that situation.? Pettine said Leonhard is good at fielding the balls in short field situations. ?Depending on the circumstances of the game, if it?s a pooch punt situation, I think Jim Leonhard is one of the best punt catchers in the business,? Pettine said. ?He?ll argue that he?s more of a punt returner, but he?s a guy who you can trust back there as well. We can trot some different combinations out there in the kick return and punt return.? Jordan Poyer is listed as Benjamin?s back up on the punt returns with DB Jim Leonhard and Taylor Gabriel behind them. Benjamin has been more productive on kickoff returns with four for 85 yards (21.3 avg.), including a long of 28 yards. WR Marlon Moore is listed as the first kickoff returner and he is averaging 32 yards a return. Notebook Competition for Yount: The Browns signed LS Charley Hughlett to the practice squad on Tuesday and Pettine said he is in direct competition with LS Christian Yount for the snapping duties, including this week?s game with the Titans. ?We?ll rotate those guys in practice, and then I?ll rely on ?Tabes? (special teams coordinator Chris Tabor),? Pettine said. ?We?ll talk about it at the end of the week if we want to make a move or not.? Practice squad players can be added to the active roster at any time. Pettine said he and Ray Farmer want competition at all positions. ?I just think it?s something that we need clarity on that situation. Christian?s a competitive guy, and he?s very serious about his job. We?re not going to hide from the fact that he struggled. He?ll be the first one to tell you. He knows he needs to get better, but at the same time we have to move forward and put the team in the best position to win. He?s done well here. He?s had his struggles of late, but that?s something that (General Manager) Ray (Farmer) and I talked about from the beginning and it?s been at nauseam about competition at all positions. That?s one that we?re not going to exclude. This is a normal part of our process.? Bryant, Tate Limited: DL Desmond Bryant was listed on the pre-practice injury report as limited with a ?glute? injury. In addition, RB Ben Tate (knee) and WR Marlon Moore (illness) were listed as limited. The official injury report will come out later Wednesday afternoon. Bryant and Tate were on the field taking part with their position coaches and players during the portion of practice open to the media. Pettine said Tate had no setbacks and he?s going through the normal progression. ?That?s normal progression that he took individual (reps),? Pettine said. ?He?ll take a good part of the team reps today. Then assuming things progress the way they should, he should be listed as full at some point ? either tomorrow or Friday.? Expecting Locker: Pettine said the Browns are expecting to face QB Jake Locker, who missed last week?s game with a wrist injury. ?We?re expected to play (Jake) Locker can make all the throws and can scramble.? He practiced late last week and they were confident he was going to practice this week. Locker said he took part in all parts of practice on Wednesday on the conference call with the Cleveland media.
Extra Points ? A defensive update: Jim O?Neil is in his first season as an NFL defensive coordinator after rising under the wing of head coach Mike Pettine, starting with the New York Jets in 2009. It?s far too early to characterize O?Neil as being ?under fire.? But through three games the side of the ball for which he is responsible has underperformed. No one would argue with that. On Thursday, O?Neil addressed issues that have lingered over the bye week since the team?s 23-21 loss to the Baltimore Ravens. * On ProFootballFocus.com?s ranking of Phil Taylor as 70th out of 72 defensive tackles and Ahtyba Rubin 50th out of 52 nose tackles: ?I don?t pay attention to that stuff. I pay attention to what our coaches say and what I see on film. If Phil or Rubes were playing like those guys are ranking them, they wouldn?t be playing for us. ?I think Phil?s having a good year. You can?t get caught up in the stats. If he?s being disruptive inside and not allowing balls to wind back in the run game because he?s getting penetration, or he?s eating two blocks at the point of attack so Karlos Dansby and Craig Robertson can be free over the top to get the tackle, that?s something that doesn?t show up on stats (but) he?s filling up his grade sheet with pluses. I?ve been happy with Phil. ?I still think (Rubin?s) one of the better run-stopping defensive tackles in the NFL. He does a real good job at the point of attack. Those guys have been pretty solid for us inside. Most of our issues have happened at other places in the defense. They?ve done a good job inside so far.? * On Joe Haden?s early struggles: ?I?m going to tell you I don?t think it?s fair to say he?s not playing well after four (bad) plays. Joe draws the hardest assignment on our defense every week. Joe probably draws the hardest assignment of anybody in the NFL for what we?re asking him to do. Joe?s looked great and he?s looked like a dominant corner at times. In critical situations, he needs to make some of those plays. Joe knows that. He practices like an elite player and prepares like an elite player, and I?m confident as we get rolling Joe?s going to make those plays.? * On Barkevious Mingo?s changing role as a coverage linebacker: ?He?s getting most of his reps as a SAM linebacker, which is more of the drop LB in our system. I think this past week was huge for Mingo (getting over a shoulder injury). He?s been a warrior fighting through it. Having the week off and getting it back to almost 100 percent will be big this week. ?He?s getting the jobs done that we?re asking him to do. He?s a guy that?s obviously very versatile so we can ask him to do more than some of the other guys.? * On whether Mingo has failed as a pass rusher, for which he was drafted: ?I don?t know what (former Browns CEO) Joe Banner thought of him. When I was at Buffalo, I thought he was a versatile player, kind of a dual threat to rush the passer, to blitz and to be able to drop in coverage and play man coverage on tight ends. I can?t speak to why they drafted him. I saw him as a player that had a lot of versatility, that could be multiple in our package and we could play him in a lot of different spots and drive an offense crazy with his skill set.? * On how the play-calling situation is divided between Pettine and him: ?It hasn?t changed. It?s mix and match. I wear the communication device so I?m talking to Karlos Dansby, who communicates to the defense. Mike and I talk a lot during series, we build the gameplan together, usually meet the night before the game to talk over game situations. It?s constant communication between the two of us. Throughout the week, we spend a lot of time watching film together. It?s something we?re very comfortable with. We?ve built a plan going back to 2009 when we were in New York.? Brownie bits: Pettine said there is no change in the plan to return Ben Tate (sprained knee) to his starting running back spot, as long as his practice week continues well. Tate?s workload has increased each day ? Pettine said it doesn?t mean Tate is the automatic starter the entire year. ?We?ll evaluate it week to week,? Pettine said. ?If we feel the two other guys are deserving in the 1-2 spot, then that?s the way we?ll go. I?m not going to make a blanket statement saying that a guy gets injured he?s guaranteed his job when he comes back. I can?t say that. Everything will be on a case by case basis.? ... Pettine said that suspended receiver Josh Gordon has been in the team facility on a daily basis and follows a personalized schedule. Gordon can attend meetings, eat with teammates and use the weight room -- but without the team involved. Gordon can not appear on the practice field or on the sideline. He is eligible to be reinstated on Nov. 17.
Own the ball, win the game Here?s one solution for the betterment of the Browns this season. Be the team with the football at the end of the game. It?s really that simple. Based on what has transpired thus far this season, the team with the football at the end of the game has won. That?s right . . . three games, three game-winning field goals with no time left. That?s how close the Browns are to a 3-0 record as they head back into action Sunday in Tennessee. Or a 0-3 record for you pessimists. So 1-2 isn?t as bad as it looks right now. The fact they had a chance to be unbeaten with any kind of luck at this juncture is fairly incredible. That they were in all three games against three pretty good teams speaks well, so far, of the progress they have made. This is not a bad football team. It has flaws, especially on defense, but it also has strengths, especially on offense, that were not foreseen. Unless catastrophic injuries occur, it is not a team that will compile another double-digit losing season. Unless the coaching staff completely and utterly suffers severe brain cramps, this team has a chance in the next five weeks to make some noise in the AFC North. The combined record of the next five opponents is 4-16 and the Pittsburgh Steelers, coming up a week from Sunday at home, own half of those victories. Tennessee and Tampa Bay are 1-3 and the Jacksonville Jaguars and Oakland Raiders are winless. Three of those five games are at home. Sure, it's easy to look at the schedule and strongly suggest certain games are winnable. Based on the way the season has begun, it becomes even easier once teams establish winning and losing patterns. For example, the Jags and Raiders have scored a combined 109 points and permitted 255, a point differential of 146. They are clearly the worst teams not just in the AFC, but the entire league. The Browns should have no problem handling them, right? Certainly not based on how they have played to this point, right? Yes, they were extremely competitive (except for the first half of the Pittsburgh game) in the first three games against tough opposition. But you always have to factor in how they play against the so-called bottom feeders of the NFL. It is possible ? not probable ? that they play down to their opponent?s level. It?s definitely a mind-set when you enter games you are supposed to win only to play poorly and lose. With these Browns, though, that should not be the case because they know what it?s like to be considered fodder for the opposition. They should have no problem staying humble. For some reason ? and I?m having trouble putting my finger on it ? I don?t see that happening with this team. There seems to be a confidence, especially on offense, that has been missing since the 2007 season, when the Browns shocked the league and turned out a 10-6 record. Credit quarterback Brian Hoyer with that. Once Mike Pettine has enough confidence in his defense to turn it loose and play much more aggressively than it has, that fine balance of offense and defense will begin to take hold. The most surprising aspect of this season has been Pettine?s reticence to unleash his brand of defense. It?s anyone guess what he?s waiting for. Maybe he doesn?t feel confident enough in his personnel with Cleveland to replicate the ultra aggressive style he championed last season while guiding the Buffalo Bills? defense. If he does, he?s keeping it to himself. Then again, perhaps it takes time for the personnel to feel comfortable enough with the new scheme and realize positive results. Thus far, that has hardly been the case as the offense has been the saving grace. If the season continues to unfold with no appreciable changes in that defensive approach, it would be fair to assume the Browns will heavily target that side of the ball in the next college draft. But that?s next year. Dead ahead are the Titans. And if the Browns have the ball in the waning moments of that game and the score is close, expect good things to happen, at least based on what we?ve seen thus far. Unless, of course, the lead is secure enough not to worry about that. With a shaky defense and an offense that is playing relatively flawless football, it is not out of the realm of possibility that a fourth straight nail-biter could be in the offing. Posted by Rich Passan
