If this continues in Florida... its a great story. I really dig Gerrard Gallant. Always liked him from way back in his Red Wings days. He is a front runner for COY, in my opinion. ___________ They are playing well and getting great goaltending. They have an old man leading the pack on the ice, a good mix of youth. Whats not to like? ___________ I do hate the fact they are struggling attendance wise. Are they selling tickets and just have a lot of no-shows like in Detroit, or are they just a victim of circumstances?
I've only attended one game in Sunrise, but for this discussion I believe that's a large enough sample to draw conclusions. People complain about the location of the arena, and in non-traditional markets that is a factor since people do not want to fight traffic to watch something they do not have a deep passion for yet. That's why you see a larger than normal number of away sweaters there; the area has snowbirds that still maintain their allegiance to their "hometown" team. The issue is why has S. Florida failed to develop an indigenous fan base while other places, (like TB, Nashville, and yes, even Arizona), have had various degrees of success in doing this? IMO, the failure to develop a fan base is because the Panthers have not respected the game. They treat the game as if it's just another event on the crowded entertainment scene and they have to one-up with the glitz. The noise and fan encouragement is not timed to game events; it's not even timed to hockey events. They're promoting an extravaganza and not hockey. And, people are not going to go out of their way when they can be similarly entertained nearer to home.
Two things: First, I had no idea there was a Panthers section, here. As a fan, I would've jumped on this a long time ago. Awesome to see it. This team needs talking about. Second, let's not let this conversation descend, as every single one almost immediately does, into talk about the local fan base/organization/attendance/blah blah blah... I'll try and settle this quick, so we can actually talk hockey, as opposed to thing I actually always end up talking about when mentioning the Panthers (see: the thread I created a year or two ago on this team) . Fans want a winner. That's how you build a fan base. The Panthers are winning this year, but haven't previously. Most importantly, neither the Panthers nor any South Florida team have won with any continuity. To the contrary, South Florida sports fans have lived with either very poor teams, or teams that win one year, only to sell everything off and see the cellar the next year (see: Marlins, Heat, though the latter is more of the nature of the NBA). Let's take the experience of someone my age: The Marlins win it all, sell everything off. Win it all, sell everything off. The Heat win when big names join D-Wade in a Championship effort. The Dolphins suck. The Panthers have sucked. It's hard for that kid to get on board, with his team. The Heat have a large fan base, compared to most NBA teams, and that's because they've had consistency, despite the nature of the NBA. Thankfully, I'm a fan of teams from out of town, but that brings me to my next point... Children grow up as fans of a team usually either because their family is die hard fans of a team/live in the area, or because the rich, winning tradition of a team draws them in. In South Florida, we often have neither. So many people are transplants, here. That doesn't mean you can't grow a fan base with those people, but it means the only way of doing so is building that consistently winning team. And, again, we haven't had that. Also, there isn't tradition for teams down here. Most sports teams are literally ingrained in the area they're from. Detroit breathes the Red Wings, and has for a very, very long time. Chicago, Boston, New York, and so on, in each sport. We also don't have that. A lot of these teams were established in my young lifetime. And then we have the fact that a game, here, is one of many attractions, and is often inconvenient to get to. I'm going to two more Panthers games this year (Boston and Detroit. Fuck 'em). It's gonna take me two hours on crowded highways, and that's presuming there isn't a major stoppage (which, if you've ever driven through the area, is common). I don't live that far away from the stadium, relatively - I'm only a county away. But in Florida, getting anywhere takes forever. You add that into the fact that the beach and/or nightlife you can't get anywhere else is right around the corner, and it's not always preferable to go to a game. As a huge fan, I only get to three or four a year. And, finally, nobody grows up playing hockey, down here. Most have no idea how to ice skate, and most have never tried/been to a rink. We haven't seen snow, let alone frozen ponds. So, again, kids don't grow up gravitating to it, and the adults that move down here often do so to get the fuck away from it. There's a youth movement going on down here, and professional leagues as well as the local fan base will start to reap the benefits - just not quite yet. The fan base is growing. Plenty of people down here are getting excited about the Panthers. But unlike other markets, it's going to take time, and continued success, because every other factor works against us. So when talking about the Panthers, talk hockey. Because not only will you be getting to talk about something vastly more interesting, but the person you're talking to will get to talk about the Panthers, rather than something relatively unrelated to them, and that will help to grow interest, and will be better for everyone in the long run. Please and thank you. Cheers. Edit: KilkennyDan - that's not to jump on you. I appreciate the perspective and input, and I didn't feel like you or anyone else here had any ill intent - rather the opposite. It's just something you get tired of talking about. And I won't disagree with you that the celebration of hockey during the game isn't as strong as it is elsewhere. I'll tie that both into trying to attain a fan base, and the lack of one contributing. I think we'll see that develop. I know I have, over the last few years. Each year the hockey itself becomes a bigger focus, and local trends and traditions during games are growing. Again, I think it just needs time and consistent success.
Now, to hockey: Can we stay fucking healthy? I'm fearful that the struggles of bad health and constant changes are having their effect on team morale - it's shown in a couple games, lately. It doesn't help that the officials are letting teams take their shots. The Panthers are not going to be confused for a rough-and-tumble team. But it seems that teams have started to come at them as physically as possible, knowing that's how to beat them - and not only is it working, but the refs are consistently letting it get out of hand. Montoya got popped in the head, the other night. "Upper body injury", emergency goalie called up, I haven't heard on how long he might be out. It's going to be a rough road to the end of the season. I hope they can get back to their fighting form. Let's go Cats!!!!!!!
I agree they need to be talked about. Tim gave it a seat at the big kids' table If it comes to that, the gripers better leave the 90s gripes at home or in the grave (where they belong).
Hear, hear!! Thank you, Tim. I love talking Panthers hockey. This is great. And yes, hockeybob, well said. Let's talk about today's hockey. I'm all about it. Sadly, I don't get to watch many games that aren't on Monday or Wednesday night. And even then, I miss some due to taking care of a family member. I catch replays whenever I can. Will, I owed you some conversation about the last Detroit game, but I wasn't able to watch. I will, however, be at the next one! Cheers, everyone!
The Panthers have a very stable setup. The owner wants to develop around the arena meaning they're incentivized to secure and retain the arena management contract (the gem of the arena in Sunrise). The team is tied to that contract meaning the Panthers have to stay. The owner is taking the long view. While the Panthers will be a secondary interest to them, they have reshaped the business model and the franchise is going to move up a few notches in relation to the rest of the league. Revenue will be improved and more stable and that will carry over into the hockey team and hockey operations eventually. There have been tremendous strides for the last 2 years. In the meantime Hockeyops (Dale Tallon) has been accumulating assets for 6 years, and they're finally ready to turn the page from old model that had them trying to remain competitive every year on minimal resources. It appears they're ready to make their first anticipated playoff appearance in a long time. Will they be able to stay? Interesting times ahead for the Panthers. It's a good time to hop on board. Even if they struggle, there are a couple potential franchise players worth watching and the next 3 years will not be boring anymore.
In trade news, Pirri to the Ducks for a 6th seriously bums me out. I spent 24 hours thinking his career might be over, with the ankle injury, only to find out it wasn't near as bad as it looked/speculations, and we would likely have him in some shape or form for the playoffs. Now, I'm watching him go somewhere else for a 6th rounder. Such a bummer. He was a scorer, and that's about it, but I liked having him. Losing the shootouts we didn't have him for wasn't a coincidence. They traded for Kindl, if I remember correctly, for a 6th. So essentially, it was Pirri for Kindl. I would've kept the kid. But Gallant clearly didn't mind. I'm sure his vote was the one that got him sent packing. Ah, well. I hope he does well in Anaheim. How about some love for the Trocheck/Jokinen/Smith line? Those middle lines have got real talent. I think that was the biggest benefit to getting Hudler, and even Purcell - they can fill spots where needed without breaking up a line or two. The efficiency they had during their win streaks was busted up by injuries, having to move guys around. Hopefully this is insurance, and gets them back to the chemistry they had in those groups.
The reason Pirri only got a 6th was because Tallon didn't plan his roster very well and he had to unload a player that would be lost to waivers now or later. He had too many non exempt players on the roster so he turned a 3rd or 4th round trade target into a 6th because his back was against the wall. Tallon admitted (quote on the trade thread) that Pirri's defense was the problem. He struggled with coverage ever since he was drafted and never took the next step. He's still a very good shooter.
I'm anxious to see what these lines look like against well structured defensive teams like Detroit, WAS, or NYR, maybe even NJ in multiple consecutive games. FLA has a very soft schedule going into the postseason so Gallant will be able to tweak his lines and experiment a bit without putting a playoff berth at risk imo.
Yeah, and I think that's pretty plain to see. I was hoping there wouldn't be a real casualty after the three-man add, and go figure it was one of our more dangerous scorers. There's no doubt his defense was his problem - he's a one-way player, right now. I guess they figured they have enough scoring threats in their first three lines without him. I don't think I would've handled things that way, but ultimately it's not going to decide the future of the season (at least, I hope not) or team. I'm excited to get the new roster look up and humming, and just hoping we get everyone out healthy. If it wasn't so damn close at the top, I might be able to relax, a bit. Big games against Boston and Detroit, coming up.
Pretty much word for word what I was thinking. I do think the matchup for the playoffs is going to be a big deal. I think it'd be great to see them take on a strong defensive team, because not only would it be a good game to watch, but I have confidence in the Panthers. I just don't want to see them take on an overly physical team. We haven't handled that well, this season. Maybe it's too much youth, maybe it's a lack of that next-level crushing speed to make teams pay for going too physical, but that's been our bane.
dline, FWIW I'm a Buffalo fan and very adept at taking shit from others. I appreciate your comments. I go to a lot of hockey games all over the country and I do believe this qualifies me to comment about the cities I visit. I do not have a Miami-centric view of things. In a nutshell, I believe that if the Panthers started to promote the great game of hockey rather than promoting an event that happens 41 times/year at Sunrise, then they would start to gain local fans wanting to see the Panthers because they love hockey. They do a very poor job of that IMO. I'd like to see it change since - in one sense - there are no non-traditional markets anymore. Roughly 25% of the NHL plays their home games in places that had no exposure to hockey 30-40 years ago. If these teams do their part in promoting the game then the NHL can attract a national footprint. If the footprint is large enough then there will be deals with TV etc. Florida is going to have a team for the foreseeable future, and I'm glad. I do not want to see it just survive there; I want it to thrive. That was the primary basis behind my earlier message.
I live in Denver. There are a lot of people that get excited about the local teams - when they're winning. The Broncos are exempted from this, but when a team is not winning there are just too many other fun things to distract us. Despite two SC's, strong youth hockey, and a D-1 powerhouse in town, Denver is just not a hockey town. It's going to take a lot of time and effort to make Miami a hockey town. The current success has to help a lot, but it's once people understand hockey that they become hooked on it. The Panthers should be jumping on their current situation - winning team and special characters on the roster - to truly promote the game. Hell, instead of having them out at the local rink to teach the fundaments of the game, they could achieve a lot of that by using in-line skating facilities. But promote the game during those 41 home dates! Half the time I was at Sunrise I was wondering if I'd gone to a hockey game and a rock concert broke out.
Panthers sign two twenty year olds, Dryden Hunt and Jayce Hawryluk, to entry level contracts. Liking it.
Didn't last long at Habs camp. Really strong and a good shot from what scouts say. I have no idea if he's making his own shots or if he's just benefiting from playing with Brayden Point. No word on the other teams Tallon beat out to land him. This is a "Tallon guy" if I've ever heard of one. If they can fix his skating, he might be useful. Hawryluk was a 2nd in 14'.
Panthers are in a serious funk. Turnovers deep in their own zone leading to easy goals, missed opportunities on the offensive end... This is not good hockey, right now. I can't tell if it's because it's just a poorly timed funk, if still having a few guys out thrown in with a handful of new guys is going to take some time to gel, or if the youngsters on this team blew their was too early/are not ready for the late season grind. Maybe a combination of all three. One game back of Tampa, one point lead on Boston with the home game against them tomorrow... Gotta get back to it, Panthers. I'll be 10 rows up, looking across the Panthers attacking goal. I'm hoping to see a win.
Lots of rookies and young players, they'll be up and down the rest of the year. Gallant had the same streakiness in CLB years ago, doesn't look like he's really adjusted to hedge the volatility in the Panthers' game. With 6 of the next 10 against stronger teams in the conference, the roller coaster isn't about to end. Fortunately, they have a very soft schedule to finish the year. They'll have a chance to spread minutes, build some confidence, and clean up some details prior to the postseason. They just have to stop the bleeding, PHI and OTT aren't strong enough to catch up to them in the standings. A playoff spot isn't in serious jeopardy.
