Also, for the record - there were telling differences between Trubisky and Fields, before they ever took an NFL field, to me. Not to say that those matter, but it's why I knew the former was a bust, but am optimistic about the latter. Trubisky couldn't earn a starting job at a mediocre college program, behind a guy who had no NFL future. Fields earned a starting job for a team with National Championship aspirations, among other talented options at the position. Trubisky showed me, in interviews and in his college play, that he wasn't bright enough between the ears to get it. Fields... I don't know about yet. But Trubs literally sounded EXACTLY like the brother of a buddy of mine, and that guy couldn't find his way out of a paper bag. So I'm hopeful for Fields, but it's largely because I haven't seen the obvious red flags that I saw with Trubisky before either took an NFL field.
Nope, nor is it playing to its weaknesses. When you're offensive line and receivers are a dumpster fire, and your QB arguably holds to the ball too long, but your running game appears to be clicking why wouldn't you run more play action in the hope to gain a step of separation and quicker release? WTF and am I missing here?
Yeah, I'm all about this team running the ball. If Fields throws 11 times in a game but the team is winning, then let's do it. But when those 11 passes don't play off of the work you've done in the run game, then you're not giving your team the best chance of success. I get that the OL sucks (really, Braxton Jones has been your clear #1 at LT from the start of training camp, and he's THIS bad?), but you can scheme to help them. Can you fix the problem? No. But you can scheme to find ways to succeed. I don't see them having done that, so far. We're only two games in. Let's see how this goes.
He didn't your right, but I contend he still had more than Fields. A legit no1 WR for at least part of his time here. A move that was made ahead of his 2nd season too if I recall. Something like 260catches over a 3 year span, that's a hell yeah. I know we all used to get pissed off at how much he ran OB, but Tarik Cohen pulled in like 150balls over 2 seasons for Trubisky. There maybe weren't a ton of game breaking plays in there, but his short area quickness meant he regularly got open and moved the chains. He was an outlet. Where's Fields' No1 outside? Where's his outlet? The worst part is the way the Bears are going about this is one of the easiest ways to fall into exactly that. Putting good players around him cuts both ways, it increases the chances of him developing and making it, but it also shows you quicker if he's not actually the guy. Thats why I mentioned Daniel Jones earlier. The Giants wasted 2 years before realising the couldn't definitively evaluate him until they isolated whether the problem was the QB or the lack of supporting cast. It wasn't until year 3 before they could really begin to answer that question. The Bears are well on their way to doing the same thing, tho I think you could actually argue even the Giants made more effort to help Jones early on than the Bears have with Fields.
Jones had a really bad draw, going up against 2 very good players the first 2 weeks of his career. I really don't know if he's good or bad. But things are gonna level out on the matchups front over the next several weeks so we'll get to see about him. They have tried to scheme him some help at times. Kmet and Griffin have both lined up next to LT in both run and pass situations intermittently.
I don't follow college really so I rely on draft analysis from you guys and others, but this is a solid point I did overlook, and especially since you actually watch college I can respect this. Even guys that are hyped though (Tim Tebow - imagine he declared after 2007 rather than playing another year, he'd have been a high draft bust instead of a late round bust - just the first one I thought of). That leap from college to NFL is always tough. I get that there are less red flags though. To this and your point about a game plan to Fields strengths, he did have some designed runs/read option/RPO plays called. Given the low number of possessions and how well the run game was working, it was a solid 1/4 of the pass play probably? I don't argue that the playcalling could be better, but I also don't necessarily let Fields off the hook for that alone either. Him, the playcalling and the garbage we are trotting out to receive the ball all play a part. That's a good point, he did have the checkdown in Cohen that first year. The second year with A.Rob and a really, really good defense gave him a better situation no doubt, that was Pace's "all in" year. We also have to remember that Mitch had to deal with Nagy playcalling as did Justin, and the book is definitely out on Getsy. Technically Fields had A.Rob last year too, I guess as a distraction as he dogged his ass around the field, so maybe that's first year equivalent to Cohen? My point was only that just looking at their first year though, they were pretty damn similar on paper, and even in games it was a lot about processing, knowing when to throw the ball away, don't hold it so long, etc, etc. Fields in the second year definitely has a worse roster, no question, from the line, WRs, and *definitely* the defense. That being said, I think by the end of this year we shouldn't be totally clueless. If he is worse than Mitch, we should know at least that much. We won't know for sure if he's Mitch or for real though. The only excuse I can make here, and it's not much of one, is that they hired the coach not based on the current roster and were fine with blowing it up and then for the few picks they did have (thanks Pace) they chose to try and shore up the new defense. But that to me goes back to my point that they don't believe in him. If they did, they would have prioritized putting more pieces around him to evaluate him and THEN build the defense. Go for the track meet/shoot-out approach. To me it feels more like I said, "hey, if you're really so great, show us with this crap" and then if he isn't *great*, they get a guy they drafted. I really don't care what they say, actions speak louder than words.
Quarter of the season is done and by any objective measure Fields is the worst starting QB in the NFL. And I thought yesterday was his best game of the season, and his number still looked like a QB from 1975. Unathletic Patriots third string rookie (4th round pick) comes in yesterday with zero practice with the starters and plays better against the Peckers than any QB we've had since Rex. Fields will never be a good QB whether with us or another team. I'd even go out on a limb and suggest trading Fields if you get a 2nd in return but no team would make that move at this point. Run defense blows. With Roquan likely gone after this year we have to rebuild the entire front 7. But are we actually "rebuilding"? Are we building anything? Flus is a pussy in the mold of Dick Jauron and Fox. I hate everyone involved with this team.
That’s my question. I was on Twitter venting and I see fans saying “they have a plan, be patient”. But what’s the plan? What are we actually building towards? If the plan is to develop Fields….you’re failing. I want to believe in Poles. I liked this offseason approach for the most part. But one look at the product on the field and it’s painful. And I don’t really know what the offensive gameplan is. It’s very confusing. I don’t have any clue what Getsy is doing. And therefore I can’t put any trust in Eberflus. It’s all frustrating. In so many ways.
The Fields needs weapons talk and Fields needs protection stuff just needs to stop. QBs all over the league are doing more with the same talent around them or even less. I’m tired of excuses. We finish at or near the bottom of the league in most offensive categories every fucking season.
I think "the plan" question is spot-fucking-on. If the priority was Fields, they have failed in every measure. Offensive line still horrible, defense can't stop the run, doesn't have the pieces needed to have transitioned to a base 4-3, and the best player on the team isn't under contract for next year... If they're trying to tank, they're still not doing well at that, winning two games they didn't really have business winning, and definitely not good enough to compete for real this year. Poles is a very young GM learning on the fly. The offensive coordinator and quarterbacks coaches are very young for their respective positions, and also learning on the fly. Feels like they're in for a longer timeline to turn this team around than they had thought.
I actually passed out in the 3rd quarter and woke up sometime in the 4th quarter. Apparently Eddie Jackson had a pick? It's a sad fucking day when the player of the game is a kicker you signed who was bagging groceries the day before. Agreed, along with BWW's point, the excuses are a bit much. "If you put Aaron Rodgers behind this line with these WRs he would struggle too!" No, he wouldn't, and it's not a fair comparison sure, but a better question would be, if you put Herbert, Hurts, Murray, Allen, Mahomes in this offense would they look as bad as Justin? NO! They would look worse than they do in their current offenses no question, but would they be this bad, I have to believe no. This was his best game no question, WR drops and pressure, and the big play to Mooney, BUT, he also had some poor/missed throws. The Giants were stopping the run and daring the passing offense to beat them. They of course, did not. There were some flashes this game, and more of the blame falls on others, but he's still not putting it together yet. I get the QB position is special, but can you imagine any other position us as fans making as many excuses? If our LT gets smoked by a primo pass rusher, that's an excuse, if he gets smoked EVERY WEEK, he's ass and we talk about finding his replacement. If a WR can't get separation, we don't make excuses. These positions all take time to learn, but there is a big difference at where you start. We could give Mitch another few years and he could maybe be serviceable, but no, we cut bait (and a year too late). Grossman, Cutler, both of those we held until we were so beyond proof that they weren't the answer. None of these guys went anywhere else and lit it up. Mitch just got benched in Pittsburg, they gave him 3.5 games and there's the fucking hook. Justin has to play better. This is where you are confused. The plan is to completely rebuild the roster, Fields be damned. That was clear from the moves the made in the offseason, blowing everything up. And when you look at the state of the roster, it's way more grim than I would have expected. Gordon is *not* Jaylon Johnson rookie year (to the point I have above about developing, no one is giving this kid a million excuses about being a rookie, new system, etc, they call it like it is, right now this kid is terrible). Roquan is having a perfectly decent season, but I'm sure he will still want to be paid like a superstar so he may not be around soon enough. Even at RB, which is where we have the most talent, Monty might be a casualty. Jones hasn't looked good, to put it kindly, Mustipher is complete ass, Kmet is garbage. And it's not the end result of losing that says this, its the individual plays that *aren't* being made all over the field. I could easily see Fields as the "bridge" QB to the future star, but man, even as a bridge he has to play better. Right now he's acting as the tank commander. We are at the bottom / very beginning of a rebuild. They are throwing everyone to the wolves and see what we have. Or maybe "sink or swim" is the better analogy.
Maybe we’re overthinking this. Maybe Poles got a 1st round qb he didn’t want/wouldn’t have scouted/graded where his predecessor felt the need to give away a bunch of draft picks to get at 11 or 12 overall—and now he’s in year 2 of 4/5 year deal and you can’t bench/get rid of him without the fan base going apeshit/being a bad PR debacle unless he does something retarded off the field. I think it’s entirely fair to think what’s happening is by design. Give the correct lip service when asked, before not investing anything in talent around him and using the most of your prime assets on the defense because dA bEaRz TrAdItIoN. It’s Poles’ team. Georgie won’t interfere, and for as much as you want to think the big bad boogeyman on his way out ol’ Sweaty Teddy will—he won’t either. They let Ryan pace forfeit future draft picks in a ‘produce results or get shitcanned’ year, so why wouldn’t they say ‘okay’ if/when—*hypothetically* Poles could have said while interviewing something along the lines of ‘he’s not my guy for what I envision this team to contend again but I’ll give him the best chance I can because maybe he proves me wrong.’ It’d be quintessential bears. Big giveaway for Poles’ plan will be next March/April. Is he going to draft a left tackle or wide receiver with a top 7-10 pick or draft a 3 tech/DE/Quan’s replacement? Is he going to pay big bucks for a true X or is that money going to the defense with a nice small extension for Pringle/St. Brown/the harry kid they traded for? Poles can cop out now behind ‘it’s year one, I can’t plug any and every hole this roster has with the limited resources I was given.’ And giving him the benefit of the doubt—he should have had a top 10 pick, another pick pace gave away in round 4, and more than ~25-30 mil in cap space with only 28 players out of 53 on the roster under contract when FA started. Till then, this will be a shitshow. I find altering my conscious state is the best way to tolerate this team (along with side watching teams that can run functioning offenses), and recommend y’all do the same.
I want Fields to play every damn game this season so that it's clear to even the most loyal Fields supporters that he is not the guy. Unfortunately that's not going to happen because he's going to get himself injured due to the massive hits he takes each game. My fear then is that the front office would then use the injury/not-given-enough-time-to-prove-himself excuse for Fields to be the starter for 2023, and possibly set us back another year. We can hang onto him as a backup, but if the goal is to win in 2023-24 we're going to have to find a replacement, be that a FA or a rookie.
I don't buy that the front office and coaching staff aren't all in on Fields and don't see him as the guy. Didn't buy it in the offseason and still don't buy it despite everything we've seen.
I think that the theory works, but I don't see how Poles would've been hired if that was the position he explained to Georgie originally. Georgie doesn't know the difference in players, and just wants the team to not suck horribly (though he has no idea how to do that) - I'm sure SOMEONE told him that Fields was the guy, and they'd make it work. That sounds more appealing than Poles telling him otherwise. So I have a hard time believing that's how it all went down. Whether or not Poles believes that is a different thing, but he's jeopardizing his job by doing the opposite of what he must have said to get the job in the first place. That's how I see it all, anyway.
Gonna try and keep this short, because i don't wanna waste too much of my time on that amateur hour ballgame. BWW said it best in the game thread, that game wasn't just embarrassing, that was up there with some of the most embarrassing performances we've ever seen. I totally agree with that. The Giants are a bad team with a bad QB, who were missing almost their entire WR corps and their best DL. They also had injuries consistently ticking up throughout the game. And the truth is they were never really stressed. They controlled virtually the entire game. It takes a special kind of bad to produce that. There were literally bad player performances all over the field i could talk about but i want to focus on the coaches(and the GM i guess) cos they were what really stood out to me yesterday. There are a lot of people in their current management positions for the first time in their careers and boy does it show. Im trying really fucking hard to be patient here cos i know it can take a while to settle in.....but its really hard to avoid conclusions about people being out of their depth. Like really out of their depth. I look at this Bears HC during a game and the word i see is fear. Fear of something going wrong, fear of making a mistake, fear of the situation getting away from them. If you look at the decision making thats going on thru the prism of fear the whole thing makes sense. You cant coach scared anymore than you can play scared, but the thing is teams take on the persona of the head coach, they always do so if he coaches scared they're gonna play scared. Eberflus, to me, is completely out of his depth right now. Those haunted faces he paints on the sideline during games, i havent seen that look since Dick Jauron. Luke Getsy i really wanna give a slap. He is quite simply sucking at his job. If Eberflus is scared, Getsy is scared AND incompetent. From the basic passing scheme to the over-arching gameplan to the situational play calling. Did Getsy watch the Giants Cowboys game? Cos i did and i thought the announcers actually made a valid point about that game. The Cowboys ripped the Giants for like 180 at 6ypc and they did it largely off tackle and on the outside. We spent what felt like the entire fucking game bashing away at the A & B gap and getting nowhere. Does Getsy see what skills his players have? Why the hell is Cole Kmet taking a WR screen for god sake? Does Getsy note what plays work and use them accordingly? Right at the start of the Texans game we had a huge gain on a jet sweep to St Brown and we've never seen it since. Yesterday they actually ran an effective RB screen into a blitz for a real good gain and we never saw it again. When a team's blitzing you a lot where are the quick crossers taking advantage of man coverage, where are the slants? WHERE ARE THE HOT READS! Do they exist in Getsy's offense? Cos it feels like all i see are long developing routes/plays. I swear im sick to death of this team runnign out of shotgun, particularly in 3rd & short. Thats the incompetent part.... For the scared part look no further than the amount of times we see give up playcalls on 3rd down. Not that its limited to that, its just you see it more often. Look how rarely they're prepared to try and push it downfield. .And Fields actually has a good deep ball, they're just scared of something going wrong. Speaking of Fields, and this is in no way meant as an excuse cos i agree he's not playing well and its really really disappointing, but he just seems to be so lacking in confidence right now. I say that cos one of the things i liked so much about him last season was that he played with a real sense of self confidence. It was in stark contrast to Trubisky who never displayed that imo, not really. Where has that gone? Why is he now so hesitant? Is he being coached to shift his priorities towards not making a mistake? Is he playing scared? We've seen it from Nagy to way back. The team takes on the persona of the HC. The 3rd & 2 the run up the gut followed by a punt on 4th down with 3mins left when you're down 8 was just scared shitless coaching all round and the most sickening thing ive seen since the game Nagy lost his balls vs the Chargers and kicked on 3rd down and lost the game. This HC needs to find his fucking balls.
Man. This times 1000. That was killing me all game. Why weren't they running behind Borom? The guy can't pass block to save his life but he absolutely mauls the run game. And they did very little his way it seemed.
Agree with this too and it seems like every time he completes a big pass they go right back to the run. There's never a chance for him to build on it and get a rhythm.
