Great response. I’ll take a wait and see approach and hope for the best. But when Edmunds sucks balls (again) I’m going to give you an I told ya so.
I don't think Edmunds is a bad player....it's just the way he's used. Eberflus liked Edmunds as a drop by and cover the middle of the field type of guy....using his length to eliminate the soft passing zones the cover 2 leaves. Which is fine but it make it hard for him to plug holes up front. He's not the most physical linebacker on the field so he isn't coming up in the box and stonewalling anyone. As Pat points out it's easy for a good coach and good offense to exploit that system that was used. In the right system he's probably a really effective player. It will be interesting to see how he is used moving forward.
Bears sign Case Keenum. No doubt to help Caleb the way he did with Stroud. The writing is on the wall for Bagent. The loins didn’t keep more than 2 qbs on the 53-man when Ben was there.
Thank goodness. If they went into the season with just Caleb and Bagent again, I'd be pissed. Again, it's fucking malpractice that Poles set him up to the fail, the way he did. No veteran QB in the room to help Caleb transition to being an immediate starter in the NFL? No line to block for him? Might as well have put him on IR and saved us all the trouble. Speaks volumes at how radically different the approach has been this year, since Johnson got hired. Let's hope that Poles continues to stay on his leash and let Johnson lead.
Pete Prisco 2025 NFL mock draft 2.0: Three teams take QBs in Round 1, but Giants aren't one of them Jesus fucking Christ Prisco, way to try and turn my nightmares into reality. I won't want him at 10, but you have us trade up to fucking 5, to leapfrog the Raiders for him? Goddamn it man.
What's all this I see about Jeanty being the pick to make at 10 if he's there? Poles can't be seriously considering RB when we still only have Braxton at LT plus the needs at DL and LB. Also I still want a young center at some point in the first 3 rounds to back up Dalman. But yeah never been a fan of RBs taken that high in this era unless they are on the level of Saquon or Adrian Peterson, which I doubt Jeanty is.
I am basically resigned to the fact that he will be the pick if hes' there at 10 and thats where the Bears pick. I think the Bears are buying into the hype about themselves a little bit and they think they're in a position to make borderline luxury picks. They've had a good offseason, but not that good. This is a 5 win team until proven otherwise. That said, i think there's the potential for the top10 picks to play out in a way thats very inconvenient for the Bears. If the T & the DT are gone they could easily be left picking either the RB or the TE. Its a very weird draft this year imo, i can't remember a year where there's so little true value differential between pick 10 and say pick 25. I've looked up Jeanty quite a bit just cos i do think he's plan A. I don't love the basic concept of taking a back top10, but the fact is he is an outstanding back. I understand why people are saying he's a top 4-5 overall talent in this draft. All of this brings me to my biggest fear heading into this draft. I won't be thrilled with RB being the pick at #10, but i will go fucking nuclear if he's the pick at #5. Yes, i do think there's a realistic chance the Bears trade UP in the 1st round to draft a RB. We know already that Poles has some very negative traits for a GM. Most of all he fails to control his emotions(multiple examples of this), which leads to breakdowns in personal discipline(exactly what you dont want from the guy running your draft). He also gets very distracted by shiny toys. Rome Odunze is a classic example of this. Fell in love at the combine and basically decided then and there he would be the pick. Even wanted to make a needless trade up cos he couldn't control his boner. Only thing that kept him in check was Cunningham(this has all been confirmed by Poles himself). What we don't know, and what will prob be crucial, is what side of the scales Johnson is gonna fall. I don't have a prediction on that other than the 1st round will tell us a lot about Johnson. He's intelligent and seems to have analytical/cerebral qualities. I hope this means mental discipline which leads to him keeping Poles in check. But he also undoubtedly played a role in reaching for Gibbs while with the Lions which is worrying. Cunningham was able to control Poles last year, i dont see him being able to hold back Poles and Johnson together.
I don't normally like extending young players right before a new DC comes in. You'd like to see where they fit into the new scheme. But i felt it would be a good idea to lock down Gordon, i think he's talented enough and versatile enough that a good DC will be able to get a lot out of him. Allen is a great DC. The framing of the deal in the media was, errr, interesting. Multiple people saying what a steal this is cos the contract doesnt even rank top 20 among CB's. Well, ok, but he's also the top paid slot corner in the league now so this isnt the steal some pundits have tried to make out. The GTD number as a % is also high. Not saying i hate it, but its a lot of money to put into your slot, he'll need to make an impact. I think he can. Side note: Its easy to forget now, but Gordon has come a hell of a long way. Pretty much all of his rookie year was truly horrific! He frequently blew assignments/had no idea where he was supposed to be, he clearly struggled with the straight up speed of the game at the next level. I remember ripping him some huge ones. Stevenson was better as a rookie. Hell, Sheheen gave you as much positive production that first year. So getting paid 2 years later is a big turnaround. Well done Spidey. Edwards has been one of Poles' best FA signings. The first contract turned out to be very good team value, and this makes sense too. It may look like there's a lot of money in the LB position now when you factor in Edmunds, but he will almost certainly be gone in a year.
Not being a smart ass, but enlighten me, because I don't. I understand compared to the vast sea of idiots who root for this franchise, I'm dying on a very lonely hill here. I keep asking what elite traits he has, because I see a well rounded back, a great college back, good in a lot of areas, I just don't see the Saquon Barkley, Derrick Henry, or Adrian Peterson level of 'yeah, we can't let this fall past us.' He doesn't have breakneck speed. The few plays Penn State let him get to the 2nd level, they tackled him and he couldn't do what he did all year and get to the 3rd with the afterburners. I understand some defenses in the NFL will give up the home run, but he'll get chased down from behind. The only trait I can find where scouting reports and pundits alike call him "elite," and I put that in air quotes because I still find it to be a stretch, is contact balance/broken tackles. Jeanty had a great year, averaging 0.43 broken tackles per play, or nearly a broken tackle every 2 plays. That number sounds great, until you dive in. 2018, David Montgomery had 0.38 broken tackles per play, and when the bears took him in the 3rd round, scouting reports from NFL.com, playerprofiler, bleacher report, never once put the word 'elite' in his scouting report. No, they word it as: "not easy to tackle for defenders" (nfl.com), "wont go down on first impact and will try to hurt tacklers standing up," (bleacher report). Now, to be fair, Barkley's best year in college breaking tackles was 0.36 broken tackles per run in 2016. Henry's was 2015, where he had 76 broken tackles in 395 carries, or 0.2 broken tackles per carry. Adrian Peterson went to OK so long ago there's no calculated stat for him. Jeanty is better coming out of college, and there's the unknown factor with him because he hasn't played a snap yet, yet Henry, Peterson, and Barkley--3 guys that ANY considered top 10 draft pick at RB should be held to the standard of in 2025--they got better in the pros. So is the line truly 0.05 extra broken tackles between good and elite? It's not. Treveyon Henderson from Ohio State has a 0.66 broken tackles per play rate (95 broken tackles on 144 carries). Not one fucking word about that guy being elite. Just: "uses his footwork to shake off angle-tacklers," (nfl.com), "He has nice dead-leg and hesitation-movement patterns that set up blocks and advantageous angles/leverages for his attacks," (BR), and "He’s also well-built for the position and avoids hits and bounces off of would-be tacklers well," (yahoosports). and "regularly pinballing off defenders while maintaining forward momentum and rarely going down on first contact," (nfldraftbuzz). Rashaad Penny, Devin Singletary, Jalen Wright, and in this draft--Jaquez Hunter, Kaleb Johnson, and Henderson all have better broken tackle rates. You won't find 1 other than Jeanty in a scouting report saying 'they have elite tackle-breaking ability/contact balance.' If we consider the totality, Jeanty is a back-end of the 1st round guy. I've comp'd him to Deshaun Foster, and he went at the beginning of the 2nd round. I just hate how in the world where everything is sensationalized and everybody is "generational" that Jeanty is somehow considered elite when you dig deeper into it, the data says he's not compared to other players in the same ballpark with results--yet they don't get the flowers he does. Now as to your point, previously, I don't share the belief that "there's no difference between 10 and 25 this draft," because I find that a lazy narrative because every last armchair GM can't gush over QBs and WRs the way they could in previous years when this is a top-heavy trenches draft. I won't be shocked when we see a lot of very good 1st round picks for teams, they just aren't the level of sexy as the prognosticators want it to be. Dennis Allen in his introductory presser: "Does he go outside and compete at outside corner? Does he compete some at safety? I've told him that he needs to be learning both of those spots," Allen said this week regarding Gordon's versatility. "We'll figure out where that second position is where he can go and compete. Hopefully we can find some more playing time for him." "He's played more outside corner, so obviously that would be the comfort level," Allen said of Gordon. "Some of the things that I see him do and the way that he fits in the run game tells me that he could be a fit with safety also. We've had guys that have had the flexibility to play a lot of different positions. "I think that's important in today's football where you're not just locked into one thing. Being able to be multiple and do a lot of different things. That's something that I think he can do. As we get to know him better, spend more time with him, start to get out on the field with him a little bit more, we'll have a better feel for where that second position might be, and where we want to try to work him." Bears DC Dennis Allen envisions Kyler Gordon playing multiple positions I think Allen signed on when he first got here. Though I do get some PTSD when some suggest a corner should play safety when it comes to the bears...
Like Prisco did in my link above, LOL. I don't watch college, so I rely on talking heads and draft scouting reports, and to me it should be Campbell if he falls, maybe Banks? Jeanty will hopefully be gone to either the Jags (latest rumor) or Raiders. I'm not sure how I feel about Warren, but that also seems a popular pick. Apparently in the presser Poles made some offhand comment about Wright playing LT potentially, so maybe Membou if he falls is on the table too. Hoge went on a bit of a rant on Poles boner for what he saw in college. Guys like Bates and Claypool he loved out of college, and ignored what they had done in the actual NFL. Velus Jones of course a great example of how terrible he can hang on to his original view.
Couple of disclaimers: 1- I don't wanna come across as Jeanty's legal counsel in this heh. The concept of taking a RB top10 isnt one i like in general and there's other ways i would go. But you asked so i'll mention a few traits etc. 2- You're far more the college guy than me and i think anyone reading this exchange inc me should keep that in mind. Remember the old days, guys like Dimm who would watch a 5min best plays compilation and then act like the world's leading authority. I hate that. Ideally you would be having this convo with another college aficionado like dline, sorry its just me. All that said, i think we're quite far apart on this in a few ways. Late 1st round, no way. Guys like Najee & Etienne went in the 20s and i consider Jeanty clearly above them. Especially in this class which is something else we're far apart on. There are numerous positions i look at and see a drop-off to last/previous year(s). Thats JMO. Shemur Stewart being mocked in the top10 after a 1.5sack season is just wild to me, but thats just one example. Multiple position groups i just dont find the top players that wow, which feeds in to me considering Jeanty to be so high. Bijan is a player i loved coming out of college and is just a joy to watch, personally i would have Bijan ahead of Jeanty if they were in the same draft. To your 3 comps players, errr, ok, but you've pulled up 3 future HOFers there and we know how easy a game that is to play. I don't even know why Henry is being talked about here other than to name drop. "we cant let this fall past us"? The entire league did let Henry fall past them! Half of them twice, Henry went mid 2nd round he wasnt some must have guy. Likewise i didnt get the Arian Foster comp other than he went in the 2nd round and you think thats Jeanty's general range. If thats the goal the JK Dobbins/Ray Rice should prob be the call. Foster had a different body type and a different game imo. Foster prob had better long speed, but not the same first step/explosiveness(or even cotact balance off the top of my head). His 40 time was pretty awful. I notice you didn't discuss the passing game re those 3 btw. Henry gives you nothing in the passing game, AP's hands were god awful. I can't claim to know how well Jeanty runs routes, but he has good hands and will be an asset there too. Even just taking a checkdown, he's a guy you could see beating that first defender consistently. Turning 2-3yards into 6-8-10 isnt sexy, it just keeps your offense on the field and moves the score board. Your not drafting jeanty for that of course but it leads nicely into the traits chat... I'm like you i dont like the over used buzz words and will try not to myself. Jeanty has an extremely well rounded game imo and that does count for a lot. Personally i think you sold him short a bit on the speed. Ok he's not a permanent houser like a Chris Johnson but jeanty ran in plenty of long TDs in college. He didnt do a 40 but is considered a 4.4 guy which is exactly what Saquan & AP ran. He's fast enough. Besides, Darren McFadden was fast, CJ Spiller was fast, how did that work out. Way more to it than just raw speed. Jeanty's contact balance is excellent(good stats btw), i also think he has good vision and a really good feel for the play and where to take it. Instinctiveness is something you cant teach. You mentioned Monty and you guys know what i fan i was but Monty has always been slow and it killed his draft stock. If Monty had Jeanty's speed & explosiveness he would've gone in the 1st round. I know that could play against what i just said about raw speed but there's a balance to be struck. If having just speed was enough Usain Bolt would've been the best back in history, having no speed puts a ceiling on you. I wouldn't be at all surprised if Johnson looks at Jeanty and sees a pretty perfect waypoint between Monty & Gibbs. Anyway i just wanted to get this reply in before the draft happened cos i probably wouldnt be arsed afterwards.
Keep it simple. Take the best person that protects or destroys QB’s. I do not like the “Bears O line is now solidified” vibe that has been so prevalent in the media this entire off season. Anyone who thinks this team is set at the tackle position doesn’t watch this team play. I wanted to get on the Jeanty bandwagon but just look at last year when we took Rome. Now imagine Jared Verse playing opposite Sweat.
Oh no, I wasn't lumping you in with his defense. Fans from here, reddit, to occasionally the board of dipshits/CCS, already have anointed him as the next thing and I continually find myself asking why. And I loved Jeanty at BSU. He was a good college back that was fun AF to watch. Yes, my 3 comp players--I did pull 3 HOFs. But the reason I did, because coming out of college, yes--even Henry as you pointed out half the league passing on him almost 2x (for very different reasons/assumptions he was a 1 trick pony power back, albeit the best one) was that as they came out of colleges, expectations and belief they would click the second they got into the league, and these guys all did. My point I should probably clean up, is that Jeanty has questions left and right. I don't believe like the 3 I mentioned, that Jeanty will come in to a team that has 0 at RB and just dominate. I think he's a tandem back that can shine with a great playcaller and blocking. That's just not something you take in the top 10. And I’d rather those 3 be the comps than Ronnie Brown, Cadillac Williams, and Cedric Bumson. I don't think I'm selling short on speed. MWC vs PSU with a top collegiate defense from a top 2 conference in the NCAA are different animals. A lot of guys can cruise when playing the San Jose States or Wyomings of the world, but when a defense with arguably the best front 7 last year in college football suffocated him. And in garbage time, when he could get to the 2nd level to inflate his YPC, which had otherwise been 2 all game, he was tracked down, stopped, hit, and taken down on 1st contact. His speed was definitely not a factor. I don't doubt for a second that he can hit a home run against a bottom 3 defense in the NFL, we see it more and more every week, hell we just watched the bears under Eberflush the past couple of years. LOL I recall Dimm as well, but I try to take an analytical approach. With a guy like Jeanty, I see the tape from 14 games and see the same things. He dominates. I don’t need to see the good from those games that hasn’t been found or talked about yet. Every player has weaknesses, so what are his? Some people will say singling out off-days are unfair, but I took the same approach with Zach Wilson from BYU a few years back, because the similarity is 13 games he’s a rockstar and an allstar and one game he sucks balls. Show me the bad game, and how/why he's bad. Now Wilson and Jeanty are apples and oranges, Wilson was dissected by a DC who applied simple coverage deceptions (look zone run man/vice versa, show single high S presnap then drop the S in the box to make it 2-high) which led to Wilson having a rough game where he turned the ball over a lot. Jeanty’s bad game he wasn’t fast, and all day he averaged 2 ypc. When I bring up Henry, Peterson, and Saquon, in rough games where everybody was trying to stop them, they still averaged 4-5 ypc. Hell, didn’t Peterson hit a few HR TD plays in his first couple years with Brad Childress against Lovie’s still-good, albeit aging defense? The plan was to stop and hit him and he still made plays. Jeanty didn’t, and couldn’t against PSU. To me at least, that’s very telling about what’s elite vs what’s good, but just not elite. You can tell when good teams plan for a great back, the great RB still makes plays. If Jeanty is the guy, I hope I’m wrong. I’ve been wrong before and got no problem being wrong. But—here’s to another draft where we will motherfuck Poles for stupidity, we just don’t know the depths of said stupidity he’ll sink to this year. Signs point to: watch him not take a OL/DL with any of the 3 picks in the top 41.
I would love to see this stat on guys like Sweetness or hell even Earl Campbell, both from the same era, so there's definitely not a stat for them, but I'd be curious to see what it would be nonetheless. Campbell's thighs were like tree trunks; he didn't run through defenders; he ran over them.
