Yes, but the question was regarding two specific receivers. We all see what he's doin, but that's still a whiff... EDIT: MJD just did the same thing just a minute ago on GMFB. They asked "who would have the bigger game this weekend, Hunter Renfrow or Jamar Chase?" And he responded "Cooper Kupp". lol!
It does lend to the conversation @SAS started though about trading down. I don't think it will happen, but what if both receivers are gone at #13? I am in the camp that thinks we need a reliable RT still. I am open to that or edge rusher at #13. It all depends on how the draft falls. I have had draft simulators have all receivers available to me, I've had them with both tOSU receivers gone...and I even traded down with BOTH available in one to trade from #13 to #17 to pick up the Chargers 2023 2nd rounder and still got Wilson. It just goes to show anything can happen on draft day, which is what makes it so fun.
He's my preferred target, but again because I think we can move back and still have a shot. I'm pretty confident Wilson will be off the board by #13 and I have a sinking suspicion that Olave will as well -- especially considering the injury to Jameson Williams.
I dunno about that... Olave was considered a high-first round prospect last season with guys like Ja'Marr chase and Jaylen Waddle in the mix. If he was a potential Top 15 last year, he did nothing but strengthen the argument for himself this season. Garrett Wilson blew up and offers that explosive factor that teams will fall in love with. Then you've got Drake London, Treylon Burks, and David Bell -- all of whom I think could be first rounders -- and not to mention Jameson Williams who was prior to injury. Hypothetically... 1.1 Jacksonville: Kayvon Thibodeaux, EDGE Oregon. They need a quarterback since Lawence sucks out loud but there's zero chance they make that move. Thibodeaux is the best prospect in the class despite not being a need. 1.2 Detroit: Aiden Hutchinson, EDGE Michigan. Again, probably not biggest need but local kid with immense talent. 1.3 Houston: Kenny Pickett, QB Pitt. Unless they trade for someone, they have to take a QB here. 1.4 New York (Jets): Garrett Wilson, WR OSU. My money is on one of the New York teams taking Wilson. The Jets have two wide receivers hitting the free agent market and obviously would like to get help for #2 overall pick Zach Wilson. 1.5 New York (Giants): Evan Neal, OT Alabama. This pick will change based on who they hire at GM. Gettlemen was terrible, but predictable. They're in a tough spot because there's no QB worth taking but a new GM would like their own and Daniel Jones sucks. Toss up right now and I'm going with "best available". 1.6 Carolina: Kyle Hamilton, SAF Notre Dame. Need a QB but there isn't one worth taking here. Again, BPA. 1.7 New York (Giants, from Chicago): George Karlaftis, EDGE Purdue. Building along the lines, but this could be a landing spot for Olave. Kadarius Toney flopped, their top receiver was Kenny Golladay who had 521 yars and no TDs. If they stick with Jones, they could look to get him help. 1.8 Atlanta: Chris Olave, WR OSU. Look for this to be his landing spot if the Giants don't pounce. They're set to lose their top two wide receivers to free agency (Gage, Patterson), their best prospect (Ridley) has an unclear future, and they cannot get out from under Matt Ryan's contract until 2023 ($40 mill in dead cap next year). 1.9 Denver: Sam Howell, QB North Carolina. Feels like this is a QB if they cannot coax Aaron Rodgers to sign here. 1.10 New York (Jets, from Seattle): Derek Stingly Jr., CB LSU. Again, if they don't make the move for Garrett earlier, this could be one of the OSU boys at #10. 1.11 Washington: Matt Corral, QB Mississippi. Needs a QB. Not worth it here but they don't have a lot of options. 1.12 Minnesota: Kaiir Elam, CB Florida. Could actually use a wide receiver, too, but needs more help at EDGE and the secondary. I think Wilson is 100% gone by #13 and I think there's a very strong chance (especially with Williams' injury now) that Olave is, too. So if something like this comes to pass, I think Browns must entertain a trade back scenario or -- and I hate this for the team -- take a right tackle to replace Jack Conklin.
I'm not sure they will spend another top 10 pick on a receiver. They just spent #4 overall on Kyle Pitts. Though he is a TE, he is also their #1 receiving target. I think they will be looking for complimentary players, not #1 target type players. Just my opinion. I think they target defense or O-line. You could be right, but my money is that neither choose a WR. Giants, I think you are right on here with O-line help.. The Jets need a lot of defensive help.. A LOT. I could see them going defense with both picks, but if they do go offense, I could possibly see them going for that receiver at #10, not #4. It's actually getting harder and harder for me to find a spot in the top 10 for any receiver. I think it is more likely than not, that one or both of tOSU receivers will be available at #13.
You gotta be kidding me with that, right? Yeah sure. Let's spend another high pick on an offensive lineman. The Bengals didn't teach us anything. We should invest more in slow moving oafs that will never help us win championships....C'mon man.
@IrishDawg42 nailed it. Watching James Hudson and Blake Hance try was horrendous. Baker's happy feet had a lot to do with taking so much abuse behind a struggling offensive line. Because of the nature and timing of that injury, Jack Conklin isn't suiting up for this team again. We don't address the position in free agency (for the record, I hope we do but that also comes with a hefty price tag) and we're going to be addressing it at either R1 or R2 in the upcoming draft.
And this isn't even fair... the Browns' offensive line ranked something like 3rd or 4th in pass-blocking officiency. But by position it was likely... LT - 15th LG - 1st C - 1st RG - 1st RT - 49th
Maybe it's just me, but I'd rather spend premium picks on playmakers and guys that can get into the endzone. The best O-line plan has gotten us nowhere.
I believe the "happy feet" are a direct result of our receivers' inability to separate from defenders. combined with the fact that Baker just doesn't see the field very well. The QB is constantly forced to hold the ball longer than he wants to, and the play gets blown up...We don't have that playmaker that can get open and get you 6 yards when ya gotta have it. We don't have playmakers at WR period. It's glaring, and that's why our offense is in the stone ages. When you can run the ball as well as Cleveland, there's no excuse for being near the bottom of the league in scoring.
Would you agree that Baker has shortcomings when it comes to seeing the entire field? I believe that has been an issue for him throughout his career. Some can be blamed on the old school and somewhat predictable playcalling, and some can be blamed on the surrounding talent, whether it's the O-line or the receivers can be debated, but I'm very concerned that Baker's confidence is rattled. Obviously, his development took a huge step backwards this season, which many attributed to the injuries. At the end of the day though, he was medically cleared to play in all those games. We've seen tons of QB's play through injuries throughout the years. Some thrive in that situation and some regress. I don't think Baker gets a free pass for his wildly inconsistent and mostly poor play this year. He had a great running game behind him, and we ultimately finished with the 7th best defense. There were 7 games this year where we failed to score over 14 points. That's ridiculous. Baker himself even said after several games this year that his play was poor and unnacceptable... Perhaps after WR, the second biggest question mark on this team is QB...
To be fair, the best offensive line plan was when the whole group played together and was mostly healthy in 2020. It got us to 11-5 in the regular season and 1-1 in the post. Baker's leading receivers that season were... 1. Jarvis Landry (72 receptions, 840 yards, 3 TD) 2. Rashard Higgins (37 receptions, 599 yards, 4 TD) 3. Austin Hooper [TE] (46 receptions, 435 yards, 4 TD) 4. Odell Beckham Jr. (23 receptions, 319 yards, 3 TD) 5. Kareem Hunt [RB] (38 receptions, 304 yards, 5 TD) Now, also to be clear... I 100% agree with you that we need to get Baker some weapons. I don't my saying "draft a right tackle" taken completely out of context here as there are a number of scenarios and nuances to consider. Generally speaking... Rashard Higgins is likely gone in free agency. I think that, given his price tag, Jarvis Landry is also gone/cut this offseason if both sides (player/team) cannot come to an agreement on an extension and re-work of that current deal. That's Baker's #1 recevier from 2020 and 2021 and his #2 and #5 receiver from 2020 and 2021, respectively. Austin Hooper is a liability in the passing game but if the team doesn't re-sign and commit to more Njoku, he's in line to be the premier guy (not ideal). Compounding all this is the patella injury to Jack Conklin, meaning his time with the team is likely up. Speaking today: Going into the 2022 Draft, I would race to the podium if Garrett Wilson or Chris Olave were available at #13 overall when the Browns hit the clock. As of this writing, I suspect one and likely both will be off the board by then to other teams, which leaves the Browns in a predicament. Do we take WR#3? Or do we address another critical need like RT? OR... if we don't manage to re-sign Jadeveon Clowney, now EDGE rusher becomes a major need, too and we'd need to look there. Baker's best seasons (2018, 2020) had him throwing to guys like Antonio Calloway (R), Rashard Higgins, Breshad Perriman, and Donovan Peoples-Jones (R). He didn't have big names or what would generally be considered WR#1's on his roster. His top guy both years was Jarvis. TL;DR... I don't want to commit myself or the Browns to "must take" <Player X> in the upcoming draft. I'm merely speaking in scenarios or situations where, given how the next few months fall, we could be looking at RT as the pick at #13. In fact, I think the only positions not up for consideration at the #13 spot are: CB, LB, RDE, LT, OG, and QB.
We might need @beachbum to use his PFF.com magic to support this, as the poster didn't cite the stat, but... Read today where the Browns had the #5 graded passing game through Week 7 of the season (when Baker's injury went from bad to catastrophic and the season was effectively over). I would believe this tracks since Baker was the #1 rated QB through Week 2 when he suffered the first injury. Minnesota and Chicago were sloppy overall on offense but his stats through Week 7 still have him in the Top 5 of QBs. Between the refs (Kansas City, Los Angeles) and the defense (second-to-last in the NFL through Week 7), they only mustered 3-3. It's a damn shame because the defense started turning it around after that game and finished Week 7 - Week 18 as the top in yards-per-play and points allowed.
He saw the field last year, so I know he has the ability to.Whether he lost confidence or the fact he was spending more time with his head on a swivel looking for approaching tacklers is debatable. We can have that conversation. He CERTAINLY had issues this year, I would definitely agree with you on that. He didn't have many issues in the first game, or the second game right up to the point where he made the worst play of his career...trying to tackle a defender. Then it progressively got worse as the season went on. Once Conklin got hurt, it's like Baker didn't trust his line.. In many cased there was merit behind it. Blah blah blah... You are starting to sound like every Baker detractor. Yes, he was medically able to play in the games. In other words, he wasn't going to make the injury any worse simply by playing, so he was cleared. It doesn't change the fact that the broken humerus changed his throwing motion. The torn labrum may not have changed his throwing motion, I'm not certain on that..however the brace he wore due to the injuries ABSOLUTELY changed his throwing motion. A high level QB uses their non-throwing arm to aim, with a limited motion in that arm, your aim will be off. Depending on the trajectory, it could be way off. In both cases of the broken humerus, won't allow the rotator cuff from working properly, and the harness for the labrum will not allow for the arm to come away from the body properly. This is going to wear on a player psyche. His mind knows where the ball is supposed to be when he throws it, but it isn't where his mind has told him for years it would be. I still think he gave us the best opportunity to win, but he probably should have been shut down early to let heal. Everyone else can do their due diligence on QB, I'm not wasting my time. There is nothing to consider this year. No free agents, no plausible draft prospects. I can only change what I can change for the better...QB isn't an option this season. Going INTO 2021, everyone counted WR as a major strength. One OBJ meltdown(technically it was his father) and one over paid Jarvis later and now the sky is falling. Thankfully, that position is one that can be improved upon. One GLARING need though is right tackle. If you don't get one in free agency or a HIGH draft pick, the onslaught will continue. TJ Watt plays weak side and you see him twice a year. That alone merits upgrading. Conklin won't be available and possibly will never be himself after this injury. The average length of career after his injury is 1 1/2 seasons. Tells me, it's probably bad football. Moving on from Conklin won't be an easy decision, but if they cut him it would save $6,000,000 to put towards his replacement. One way or another, he needs replaced, you tell me how you want to do it if not dedicating one of the top two picks of this draft?
