One of the big problems so far re Pagano is the scheme he's running is heavily reliant on a straight 4-5 man rush getting there a large % of the time. The CB's spend almost all of their time playing off with one eye in the backfield. I guess its designed to eliminate the big play while also giving his CB's full chance to break on the ball, particularly on rushed throws. Its exactly what we saw for Fuller's pick sunday. I believe Dix did the same thing earlier in the season(Redskins?) Problem is Pagano isn't getting nearly enough production from the pass rush to make this work. Too often it turns into 10-15yard passes that just look way too easy. Fuller has played 10yards off a non-WR split out wide the last 3 games and it drives me nuts. Is the scheme too rigid? It certainly looks far less nuanced than Fangio's D last year, much more predictable. Pagano hasn't impressed me tbh, but he's not getting much help up front and that starts with Floyd. Its kinda weird that a guy of his dimensions could be much more effective against the run than the pass but he is. As a pass rusher he has been trash. In 7 games he has 18tackles, 1 TFL and 2 sacks. THATS IT!!! He must have at least 150-200 pass rushing attempts this season, 2 SACKS!!! Im not 100% sure on this, but i believe that 5th year option only becomes fully garaunteed if Floyd is still on the team at the start of the league year the option is due to run. So i think they can cut him if they do it before the start of March 2020. And if so then cut his ass! No way they can afford to pay Floyd $15mil next year.
Floyd has been a massive disappointment to me. Put a legit pass rusher opposite Mack and this defense would be posting shutouts.
Don't disagree, but the thing is ARob is one of the few guys on that Offense i actually like. And likeable WR's in particular are hard to find. My only complaint re extending ARob is that it Pace is being way too goddam slow. It should've already happened, a while ago.
Can you read? Did I say good to great. No I said great. Top tier players just don’t make it to the open market on the regular. Teams find a way to pay them. Ever heard of the franchise tag? When a top level player and a team just can’t make it work player usually winds up traded. One point you are missing here is value. The Raiders didn’t value Mack. They felt that the money they saved and picks they got would make the team as a whole better because they lacked talent all over the place. The Bears did value him because Pace has a talented team and was able to add the missing link. Amos is the same thing. Is he a good player? Yes. Not elite like Jackson so you let another team over spend because they had a greater talent deficiency. We replace him with an equal if not better talent for much less. You are so wrong on Bell you should really just not talk about it. It’s making you look foolish. Bells Offer from the Steelers was 5 years 70 mill 10mil guaranteed. Again the Steelers did not lose bell because they couldn’t afford him under the cap. Pace has been able to build the roster by signing FA’s with high upside to short term deals and then extending when they pan out or cutting bait when they don’t for little dead cap space. Yes you are correct that every team loses some talent from year to year. They also replace that talent. Sometimes it’s for the better, sometimes is for the worse and sometimes it’s a wash. The ability to replace talent lost to FA with draft picks is important. And I feel you are greatly underselling Pace’s ability to draft. He needs to do better with his 1st round picks no doubt but he has done very well outside of the first round. Everyone was worried about losing Amos and Callahan. Can anyone make an argument that there has been a drop off? Ha Ha has played as good if not better than Amos and Callahan is hurt again. Probably done for the season. You are not gonna save a lot extending Robinson but you could save enough to resign a Trevathan or HaHa. Both play low paying positions. The Bears do have enough of their top talent locked up to make the moves to free up enough space to sign Teddy B and make a run. If he is a home run a good QB makes up for some talent you may lose. As for your last comment Anybody is a cop out. No way in hell were we acquiring Stanford. And Andy Dalton sucks. So if all these better options were available who do you got? Let’s face it the Bears has to let Trubisky fail before going full in on competition given the draft capital they gave up for Mack.
What are you smoking? I would love even the tiniest bit of proof that HaHa has been a downgrade to Amos. After a strong start the GB defense is fading fast. Sorry this is a bad point by you.
Tons to dissect from this thread...... In regard to trading? With the way the cap situation (per overthecap, bears walk into the offseason upcoming with 12 and change salary cap. So Teddy Bridgewater is the prize QB. Just so we all know, he makes 7.5 mil this year as a back up to Brees, and with his short term success, he's going to get paid. Paid like a starter. Like Nick Foles money. Why? Because even though Matt Moore (after seeing him look great under Andy Reid in Mahomes' absense, he has to be a name for a back up now) and Andy Dalton may be available as consolation prizes, the myriad of trash is what's left in Tannehill, McCarron, Simien, Glennon, Hundley, Gabbert, Bortles, and Colt McCoy doesn't make this team any better. Note**I'm not counting Dak Prescott or Phillip Rivers. I don't expect Cowboys or Bolts will let either go nor can I assume they will be available. So you want Bridgewater? How do you get to 20 mil (at least) in cap space? Easiest idea is to cut Kyle Long, save yourself 6 and change mil. Turbo Gabriel and Allen Robinson both cant be on this team next year. You drafted Riley Ridley and love to tout Javon Wimms, who we all agree-like his flashes and development. Gabriel is 6.5 mil salary, cutting him saves 4 mil with a 2.5 mil dead cap cut. Robinson is 15 mil in salary, 13 cap savings with 2 mil cap hit, or 11 mil savings if you cut him. You cant cut either. Trade is an option, but I'm not expecting anything flashy. Gabriel a 4-6 rounder, Robinson a package with a 2. FWIW, I prefer to keep Allen Robinson. He's clearly better than Jeffrey or Marshall in their hay days here, and he's not a diva, or a cancer pointing the finger at everybody, nor is John Fox here to hate him and run him out of town. I fully understand he may be a cap casualty depending on what Pace tries to do. Are any of us going to object to cutting Mike Davis and saving 2 mil? Yeah, I didn't think so either...... Long and Davis alone put you over 20 mil in cap space. That being said, you need to create more to get your draft in, keep some key guys like RRH (I think we're going to lose him, price will be high because he's been solid/noticeable), Coward (cutting long leaves a hole, unless Bars or Mustipher is filling this one,) one of Trevathan or Kwiatkowski, Nick Williams is playing his way into sticking around (though coming down to the wire, it may become a choice between Williams and RRH), and absolutely Sherrick McManus (lock this guy up for life). If Cornelius Lucas at OT tickles Pace's fancy, add him to the list. Now you need to open more space. Gabriel's 6.5 or AR's 15 mil is gone in a trade (provided you don't eat any of it......). IMO, you have to keep Trevathan. He turns 30 in March and on a short term deal, isn't going to command 6+ mil per year the way he did when the bears paid him. Nick K isn't the leader or known constant Danny T is. And given Noquan's.......hiccup, where he had his issue then sucked before--objectively speaking--showing a shred of improvement against the Bolts. Sorry, Joel Iyebuniwe and Kevin Pierre Lewis. The idea was brought up of trading/losing Prince. I don't agree because he's too valuable, even going into a contract year next year. Trading him gets you at best a 2nd maybe. Cornerbacks are becoming a premium, especially over the past couple of years. Some very good names are set to become available like Logan Ryan, Jimmy Smith, Chris Harris, Eli Apple, and Jason Verrett. A team that doesn't have/want to drop double digit mil on these guys could be a buyer of Prince's modest 9 mil. That of course creates a hole, and no offense to Kevin Tolliver and Duke Shelley, but they ain't filling it. Regardless of keeping/dealing Prince, that's going to be a hole to fill in 2020 or 2021. Now of course, you could pass on Teddy, to give yourself more money to keep some guys and acquire a couple comfortably. Meaning you draft or buy low. Regardless, Mitch is on the team given his rookie deal. Assuming we're not seeing another guy get bought, the draft is an option for QBs. I immediately expect the top 3 QBs (right now as it stands, Tua, Fromm, and Herbert) wont be available when the bears pick in the 2nd or trade up. So what's after them? College has seen an increase in productive QB play, so much that some pundits think 6 QBs could go in the 1st round. Jacob Eason (Washington) has come on late so much that scouts love his athleticism at 6'6 as well as his accuracy, Jordan Love (Utah State) has accuracy and a cannon but struggles to read defenses, Joe Burrow (LSU) is a highly effective game manager with athleticism; but scouts say there's tons to like but little to love/he lacks elite traits, Kellen Mond (Texas A&M) started red hot, got beat up from aggressive defenses then rebounded and has learned how to beat college blitzes from some complicated, talented SEC defenses, and Steve Montez (Colorado) who shows tons of flashes with downfield accuracy and throwing power but needs tons of improvement; also has led 4 come from behind wins against damned good teams (<---scouts seem to believe this is special). There will also be later QB specs. There also projects draft-wise to be top heavy OLinemen, tackles and interior. All draft things subject to change as we still have some season left as well as the underwear olympics/meat market then interviews.
Why is the comparison here to Amos on the Packers? The comparison is to Amos when he was on the Bears, that's how you judge whether it was a downgrade. Perhaps its you with the bad point? Amos was extremely solid last year, there was serious pro bowl consideration given to him. Heard much pro bowl chat re Dix this season have you? No, you have not. He'll be lucky to keep his job this offseason. Dix has made one lovely pick against the Deadskins, and that's about it. Other than missing a tackles and freelancing(ie the deep shot to Ginn v the Saints). The way this is panning out the only good thing about Dix is that he's cheap and they aren't tied next to him next season. Ok, so two things.
This is a joke right? He will be lucky to keep his job? Do you honestly think that Ha Ha’s has been a liability this season? Your wrong on the freelance crap and your wrong on the deep pass to Ginn. There is a reason Jackson says something to Prince and not Dix after the play. He was their responsibility not his. When you compare 2 players you compare how they are playing right now. Not how one guy is playing now to how one guy played last season. Especially since the DC is different. Both are playing solid. Maybe one pulls away from the other by the end of the season but right now ya can’t say the Bears miss Amos.
No its not a joke. Yes I think he will be lucky to keep his job with the Bears next season(mostly cos of differences over money I suspect). No I don't think he's been a liability. But I have seen him make plenty of mistakes and haven't seen him be a difference maker enough. It seems pretty hard for you to say this for sure unless you were in a team meeting or have exceptional hearing. What we know, is that Dix was playing single high Safety on that play. A single high is the last line of defense, no one should get behind him, period. We also know that the QB moved Dix with ease, looking him off to another route the wasn't designed to get the ball. Now im not saying you're totally wrong here rob, but I am saying that if what you say is true and it was design for Prince to basically drop back into a deep S role and be the last man, that is exceptionally bad scheme from Pagano as evidenced by the fact they got beat deep and Prince didn't seem to know what the hell he was doing. Id need to hear that from a source to truly believe it and until then I've got it on Dix. He's lined up single high. He tries to come down and jump a route that the QB has goaded him into. It winds up being a big play. Personally I would rather have Amos out there for the Bears but I agree neither seems to be playing particularly badly and factoring money in this looks an ok outcome for the Bears....so far....this season. Here's my question, we know Dix is only here to try to parlay this season into a deal. Would you pay him say Amos money? Or would you let him walk.
Single high safety lined up outside the hash on the strong side of a run heavy formation? Come on man. When you watch the play the TE on the end of the formation releases and Fuller passes him off to Ha Ha who is in position to cover him deep. On the other side you have Prince and E Jack covering Ginn. E Jacks passes him off to Primce who just lets him run away from him. The RB is covered by the LB. If your going to be honest here you would think that E Jack would run with Ginn under with Prince over the top. He is the only receiver on their side. They have nobody else to worry about. Nb Why do you assume that Ha Ha would command Amos $. The reason we let Amos walk was because the Packers over paid. They paid Amos to be a top flight Safety and he has remained a solid starter. Amos didn’t want solid starter money from us so we gave it to Ha Ha. There are 64 staring safety’s in the league. Amos is the 10th highest paid. Just like with Prince you offer Ha Ha a team friendly deal or let him walk. There will be plenty of replacements out there for the right money. It’s just how the secondary safety market has gone. I will say you are not making a good argument that it’s obvious the Bears are missing Amos like my original response was to.
Whether he gets it or not is a whole other matter, but that's the kinda region he'll be looking for, you didn't know that? What Dix is currently playing on is whats known as a "prove it" deal. Its where he signs a 1 year contract for less than he thinks he's worth so he can hopefully generate enough interest from another team to land a much bigger contract the following year. Dix is being paid around 3.25 this year and it was widely reported he turned down more than that over more years from the Redskins in March. So Dix clearly thinks he's worth more than more than $3.25mil and over multi years. The Redskins prob offered him somewhere in the region of $4-6mil per year, perhaps he wants more than that. 7, 8, 9? Who knows, but in all likelihood it wont be far off Amos money. And none of that is a hard deduction to make Rob, you shouldn't need this explained to you. His cap hit is the 15th highest this year, not 10th. $5.9mil. Squarely in ballpark ha ha territory id say. Pun intended. I already did that, you just didn't like the answer so now you're trying to talk your way around it, as you tend to do.
This isn’t about how much money Dix is setting himself up to make. It’s about the talent drop off from losing Amos. You have already admitted that hasn’t been an issue so thank you for proving my point. If you are now trying to say we should have just signed Amos because Dix will demand the same money on the open market this off season I strongly disagree. But if he does we can’t afford that with the contract Jackson is do so Ha Ha will be replaced as well. Can’t say if it will be a talent drop off as we can’t see the future. Doesn’t matter what Amos’s cap hit is. His average salary is 9mill. That is the number you use when comparing players by how much they are paid. Your reaching here. With the current state of the Packers defense do you think giving Amos the 10th highest safety contract was a good move?
Actually its about performance drop off. Here was your original criteria vvvv I would love even the tiniest bit of proof that HaHa has been a downgrade to Amos. That has been provided. You don't want to be wrong, i get it, but you set yourself up for failure. Next time maybe set the bar higher. Could def say cap hit is all that matters. Do teams have to operate within an average salary structure every year? No. But anyway Dix is on a 1year deal, there's nothing else to compare here. You just got thru telling me comparisons from different years is a no no. Now because it suits you, you want to compare different years. Your goal posts have just met at midfield.
Ok Ev. Let’s look at performance drop off. I can’t believe I had to do all this digging just to prove what is obvious to the eye test. Thank you Pro football reference. Since your a fan of the past. Amos 2018 2 int 61.1 comp % against 299 yds 2 td 8 missed tackles. Dix 2019 2int 55.6 comp % against 84yds 0 td 4 missed tackles. Where is the drop off in performance? Amos 2019 1 int 71 comp % against 256 yds 0 td 2 missed tackles. The drop off in performance is from Amos 18 to Amos 19. Amos is not playing as well in GB as he did with the Bears and Dix is playing as well if not better than Amos did with the Bears.
To the title of the thread, there’s a rumor if the Bears cut Mike Davis today they would probably get a 4th round compensatory pick? If true I make that cut all day.
Dude you can waste as much of your time as you like, no problem here. But it won't change the fact your question has already been answered, sorry you don't like it. If you weren't trying to argue for the sake of it you'd just recognise that Amos' play was widely commended last year. He was in serious pro bowl contention, many believe he should've gone. This is reflected by the fact he then got a big deal in the offseason. Dix has no such pro bowl talk. He will get no such deal. The league knows what these guys are worth, far better than you that's for sure. Dix this year is a downgrade to Amos last year. Deal with it. Its funny when you hit the afterburners for average players.
Its not like they ever gave him much of a chance. But the way he's clearly not in their plans I would too.
I believe compensatory picks are awarded based on Free Agents opting to leave. I don't believe comp picks are awarded due to players being cut.
It could be a situation like the Ravens with Justin Bethel. They cut Bethel a few weeks ago because he was actively hampering their ability to get a comp pick after Brent Urban was released from the Titans. Bethel was a free agent acquisition by the Ravens, so he was a ding on their side, and with him gone, they get to take it off the ledger.
