Who's Most To Blame For That Loss

Did you watch the game? Kinda seems like maybe you didn’t. Because if you came away from that shit show feeling like Nagy let Mitch “sling it” too much... well... I’ll just keep it civil and say maybe you don’t have a feel for the game so much.

I also noticed you left out Mahomes’ completions compared to Mitch. Over 20.. how about over 30? Can we get those stats? With full disclosure on completions too?

I like that you’re a contrarian Rob, but don’t cherry pick. It’s beneath you.

 

Aren’t you in Florida? How did Dorian affect you?

Just curious. My bro in law lives on Andros and we have friends that HAD a place on Guana Cay in the Abacos. Two story house, blown off the foundation completely. Gone.

 

Its taken me 2 days and i still can't quite believe what i saw in that game. I voted Nagy. I don't know how you vote anything else.

Rant coming, feel free to skip, no offense taken.

I voiced complaints about the over-complicated nature of Nagy's Offense and his situational playcalling last season when it wasn't as fashionable so this isn't me just piling on....

That was the worst performance i've seen from Nagy since he joined the team, by a comfortable margin. When you factor in the weapons at his disposal on that O, it was one of the worst games called i've ever seen. Turdner's playcalling used to make you wanna jump out a window it was so boring, but Turdner often had 1 RB and at best 1 WR to work with. Nagy's performance was peak Martz, worse even. It was a level of dumbfuckery so astounding and so inept that if that was an OC, id say take playcalling duties away from him permanently. Frodo could've done better than this.


I know its only 1 game but it was a fucking big one and Nagy needed to come out and do well. There's some really worrying things here, stuff that last year looked like trends now look very much like traits. The needless over-complication pre-snap that doesn't actually fool anyone. The terrible situational playcalling. The complete inability, apparently, to understand who your best players are and optimize their time on the field. The chronic lack of grasp of your own shortcomings.


Re that last one, didn't Nagy say after the playoff loss that they would do a big self-scout of everything they did that season in order to get better this season? Nagy has repeatedly mentioned self-scouting during the last year. Well, basically every weakness and shortcoming Nagy has was on full display Thursday night. Like every one. So how did the self-scout go Nags??! Either you were full of shit and never did one, or you did do one and are reeeeaaaallly shit at your job. Can't be both.


Again, 1 game. But its the kind that shakes you to your core. We know now Mizzell was the symptom not the cause, thats far more worrying. 30 straight passes in a one score game that had "grind it out" written all over it, shows this became Nagy v Nagy and Nagy lost.


And holy hell i havent even got to Trubisky yet. Thursday was the first time i seriously considered the fact that Trubisky could be a mistake that costs the team years a la Emery extending Cutler. You''ll never hear me complain about Mahomes cos i just didn't see it, but as one of the guys on the Watson train like many of you, this is gut wrenching. And its not just that, go look up some of the WR's taken in the 3rd round in 2017(one of the picks Pace gave away to trade up 1 spot). It just gets worse and worse.


On the one hand i do feel there were only a handful of QB's in the league who could've put up serious points in that game given the playcalling and O-Line play. But on the other that doesn't mean you can't see that Trubisky played terribly in his own right.


This summer i talked about Trubisky slowing the game down for himself thru better processing. I know he was put in bad spots often but he can't seem to process whats going on around him and his general field vision is just awful. bww already summed it up....i don't care if he throws 10TD's next week. 5TD games in Tampa aren't what matter, being able to play in primetime is. If you can't play in primetime then you can't win playoff games.

The thought of potentially wasting another elite Defense is sickening beyond all words.

Next week Fangio is gonna pick Trubisky up by the scruff of his neck and drop him straight in a meat grinder.

 

Anyone who thinks calling 50passes, inc 30 straight in a tight one score game isn't slingin it too much is either very very drunk(nothing wrong with that) or talking gibberish. You call a 4-1 pass/run ratio in a game like that then you have def chosen to throw too much. Calling a pass is fundamentally putting the ball in your QB's hands, so yes, by extension Nagy obviously put too much faith in the QB position to win the game. Note i said the position not the person.


Im focusing on the 1st half cos thats what i saw, but the type of passes called does raise questions. Look at how the Packers DB's were playing. They were crunching down on everything. It seemed like the second a guy caught a pass someone was on his back. They could see the game that was being called, they didn't feel threatened.

FAR too many passes went to guys who were catching the ball flat footed, which allowed DB's to break on the ball. There should've been way more crosses, more getting the ball to guys in stride.

Savage was in his first game and was playing way too eager. It was crying out for a double move or fake-in deep post. The deep shot was actually the answer both Offenses needed but it was the Packers who had the balls to go for it and the play-call(fake end around, move the pocket) to pull it off. Nagy didn't.


All of that does suggest a lack of faith in Trubisky to some extent. I just think Nagy views the QB as a means to an end, ie to deliver results the way he wants(pass pass pass). We saw him come out throwing in Detroit and NY with Daniel. He's gonna throw too much whoever's back there cos he can't tailor his approach to either who the specific QB is, or what will be most effective against a given opponent.

 

And this is partly why I believed Nagy lacked trust in Trubisky. Lots of comeback routes, reminding me of the passing plays we saw when Cutler was here. No faith in trying to get the QB to hit guys in stride.

 

Drunk? Fuck yeah. So maybe I didn’t get my point across correctly.

Just because you throw it 48 times doesn’t mean you’re “slinging it”. Those were almost all chicken-shit short passes designed for safety and RAC yardage. How many times did the ball go past the first down marker IN the air? I’ll bet you can count on one hand the amount.

20 of 26 pass attempts at or less than 7 yards from the LOS isn’t slinging it. It’s a game plan that shows very little confidence in your QB.

 

I finally got to rewatch the game. I had to listen to most of the second half as I was driving home from work. The all 22 isn’t up yet so I watched condensed version which is the bomb by the way.

Most pass plays are going to have a combination of routs. What I saw when rewatching is many of the shorter throws were not first reads. For most of the game GB played with 5 and 6 DB’s. Begging Nagy to run. And he still wouldn’t. That being said it is entirely possible that the lack of hitting guys in stride and deeper down the field was more to do with how the defense was playing and the decisions the QB was making. And not just the play calling.

Mitch deserves all the slack he is getting but he did get screwed one of the biggest situations of the game.

On the drive that wound up 1st and 40 the new interference rule was front and center. I don’t think it was meant to go this way but when GB challenged and lost the Gabriel catch it set up the completely BS call that went against Gabriel on the 1st and 30 play. It was a total make up call. And how the fuck does Nagy not challenge that call? I’ve rewatched it a thousand times and even though Gabriel does touch the defender with both hands he in now way pushes or impedes the defenders try for the ball. Which was an excellent throw dropping the ball in the way Mitch did. Not saying the play would have been reversed but you have to try. Mitch got screwed by the refs and his coach there.

More Nagy BS was not going for the 50 yard FG. Could you imagine if the kid hits that. It was the ultimate low risk high reward scenario. If he hits it the place goes crazy. You just stocked up on a whole shit load of kicker confidence for both the coach and kicker and you have a 1 point game. The risk. 8 to 10 yards of field position which you were giving away all night for free anyway.

 

That OPI was complete shit.

 

It was a total make up call for a play that was called correctly (no OPI) in the first place. If Gabriel were a top WR the flag would never have been thrown. A Nagy challenge wouldn't have reversed it and then we'd be killing him for wasting a TO.

Totally agree on this. Word is that it was Tabor's call to not kick a 50+ yarder unless it was at the end of the game with the game on the line.

 

Also I hate that PIs are now challengable. I don't care what happened in the NFC Championship. Yes there are blatant misses, such as that game, but vast majority of PIs are fairly subjective calls.

Watch, some team is going to throw a hail mary at the end of a game, it will fall harmlessly incomplete, the refs will review and determine that DPI happened, give the offense an untimed down at the 1... It will be defenses that will hurt more from this rule.

 

I think the officials have been told to not pick up a flag unless it's extremely blatant and also not to reverse a no call unless it's the same.

I have a feeling you will see a lot of these PI reviews end with whatever the call or no call was on the field simply standing as is.

 

No, Kyle Long recovered it when he took out Shaheen

 

I read some analysis of the game today and they called out several plays where Mitch diagnoses the defense properly, but at the end of the day the defense played well, or Mitch had a bad throw.

But the more I think about this, not much changes. The order definitely goes:
1. Nagy - for playcalling and preseason. I know preseason is a waste of time but it’s the only way I conclude an O-Line goes so quickly from good to crap with the same guys. Playcalling he played RIGHT into the Packers hand sitting in dime most of the time. We got rid of our traditional running back and while we have some good ones Nagy either didn’t trust them or stuck to a “plan”.
2. Trubs - he was under pressure for sure, but he did not step up to the plate. I, like many of you have seen this story before. He is not going to be the franchise guy, but he will recover now that the bright lights will be off. He will be a liability down the road.
3. ST - ever since Toub left this has been a huge weakness of the team and this year is no exception. Guys with poor lane discipline. The kicker fiasco has to be at least partly on Tabor. And if it really was Tabor’s call not to kick- way to put your new kicker on blast. This is also a liability. Again.

I see some recovery the rest of the season, this defense is elite and the offense will break some plays. We’re going to beat several teams I don’t think people think we will. I see us maybe squeaking into the playoffs.

And there in the bright lights with the pressure on, Nagy will Nagy and Trubs will Trubs and we will be bounced. Tell me I’m wrong, I want to think I’m wrong. But all year as we win games I promise you I will remember the 100 year anniversary game where we delivered 3 whopping pointsagainst the cheesedicks. Won’t you?

 

I haven't changed my projections from a 10-6 or 9-7 season, the only thing that has changed is the opinion of Mitch being the guy. I know it's only one game, but last night I saw Wentz struggle at the beginning of the game and he like Mitch didn't get the work in the preseason games, except he found his groove. Tonight I'll watch the QB the Bears should have drafted, and see what he does under the lights and possibly put an exclamation point on that bogus selection.

 

If I asked everyone here whether they'd rather have the three year starter (injured for part of Freshman year) at Clemson that led the team to two NCAA Championship games, winning one, while displaying NFL-caliber passing and dual-threat athletics, or the one year starter at North Carolina that went 23-of-39 for 280 yards, two touchdowns, and two interceptions in his only bowl game appearance... Which would you rather have? I know there's a lot more to it than that, but Pace "Kevin White"'d himself with this pick in a huge way. He went for whatever his idea of potential was, rather than just seeing what was in front of him.

It's one thing to hit on a pick like that with Eddie Jackson, but miss with Adam Shaheen. It's entirely another to have your pick of any QB in the draft, with the second overall pick, something that happens so very rarely to a team... and to screw it up. That's how you stay bad.

I'd love for Mitch to prove me wrong. I'm just not going to expect him to.

 

I remember that year Aggie went through all the QB's coming out in the draft game by game including Mahomes and nobody saw what he was about, and in retrospect, I can't blame anyone for missing on that, but Aggie convinced me that Watson was the guy and believe he should have been.

 

I have always been firmly on the Watson train. I don't blame anyone for missing on Mahomes, but Watson was a no-brainer pick, to me. And while all three of these guys are young and their careers are yet to be defined, there's no doubt that Watson has been a better choice than Trubisky, and likely would've had this team winning in the postseason last year, and winning opening night this year.

Trubisky was the "riser" that started to come into the conversation because of hype, and because he tested well in workouts. Sorry, but when you have the first choice, that guy should never be it.

 

Which reeks of smartest man in the room syndrome a sure recipe for disaster. Based on what you guys were saying I thought Watson and Aggie (though I thought it was mongo) got on the Mahomes train as a low pick, I think mongo said to trade down and we’d get Mahomes.

The Bears subreddit is full of Trubs nuthuggers at the moment saying no one say Mahomes coming not Watson, except apparently a large portion of this board....

 

Pretty sick defense though. Wonder who is responsible for putting that together.

 

I try not to worry about all of this because you just don't know. Like you and DLine, I was on the Watson train, and the guy went into a pretty good situation while using some tools like legs to make things work when the OLine was beat up/traded away. Mahomes I recall many, myself included--passing on because we already just saw for the better part of 8 years we had a 6'3 QB with a cannon arm and no brains, which at Texas Tech; PM was a volume scoring guy who had some very familiar shitwad throws.

Trubisky was the unknown. He could win, but he also couldn't beat a wide receiver on the depth chart at quarterback. So you put him with Frodo and Fox......and we all agreed that set him back. Regardless of revisionist history and your preference of 'if you knew then what you know know' Mahomes or Watson would have been stunted by two idiots who the league outdated decades ago.

WRs in 3rd round? Cooper Kupp, Chris Godwin, Kenny Golladay, yeah--that's solid. Loved our 4th rounders that year, really having a bitter time with Shaheen in the 2nd. He's the bust I'm not good with.