2019 early predictions sure to go wrong

Are you really questioning that?

 

Marvin "safety slide or run for the sidelines" Harrison? I hated that guy so yeah I am questioning if he is elite, that's probably my personal bias showing though.

You were right about Bruce though I was going off the top of my head I think a HOFer probably counts as elite...

 

Teams like elite WRs, that’s why Brown will be easy to trade. OJB, JJones, Brown & Hopkins are elite right now.

 

Niether Bruce nor Holt is in the HoF

 

"safety slide"? lol! C'mon xinik...It must be your bias, because he might be the most productive WR in NFL history...

Are you anti Syracuse or?...

 

Give it time...These guys could still run a post and score.

 

It still will not change the fact that they were not elite at the time they won their superbowl. When Rice, Irvin and Haŕison won they were already. Also im not sure being a hofer automatically makes you elite. Afterall namath is in the hall but I doubt anyone other than his mother would classify him as elite.

 

Marvin Harrison.

Edit: Didn't see it was already mentioned, sorry.

 

Issac Bruce was 27, in his prime, and very much elite the year the Rams won the Superbowl.

 

I swear every pass he caught was either a TD or he immediately ran out of bounds or dove to the ground as soon as someone was near him. It drove me nuts. I know in reality it isn't true but that's always what I felt like watching Harrison play. I am anti-Marvin Harrison it has nothing to do with Syracuse or the Colts etc...

 

Reggie Wayne did it too. I think they were coached that way.

 

Oddly enough I liked Reggie Wayne.

 

He finished outside the top 10 in receptions and yards in 99 hardley elite. He was close to not being in the top 20 for receptions.

 

He was coming off an injury that saw him miss a significant portion of the previous season, if memory serves, and also played in an offense that featured Marshall Faulk first and then had a rookie Tory Holt across from him.

Bruce at this point in his career, however, was damn sure elite. He was already closing in on 500 career receptions at age 27....and he had 12 touchdowns in 99....which put him behind only Cris Carter.

Previous to this season he had a year where he topped 1700 yards and another where he topped 1300 while catching over 200 balls combined in those years.

He was elite.

You don't have to lead the league in categories to be elite. And you can lead the league in categories without being elite. There's no strict criteria.

During his prime...Issac Bruce would rank near the top of damn near everyone's best receivers in football list. And therefore....he was elite.

 

Issac Bruce was 12th in yards in 99. Here are a few guys that ranked ahead of him....

Keyshawn Johnson, Amani Toomer, Michael Westbrook, Muhsin Mohammed, German Crowell, Marcus Robinson, and Jimmy Smith.

If you had a team in 1999....would you pick any of those guys ahead of Bruce. You have a few flash in the pans there along with some average to above average receivers that simply had one or two good to great seasons. Jimmy Smith is the really the only other name that pops out....dude had a solid career. Johnson was good, definitely not great. Same for Toomer. Westbrook was a one year wonder. Mohammed was good, but also not great. Crowell was a one hit wonder. So Robinson. Jimmy Smith was actually very good....but I think it's safe to say Bruce was better.

Cherry picking some isolated stats to say a guy wasn't elite is wrong.

 

"THE GREATEST SHOW ON TURF".....not elite? That's ridiculous.

^^^Though not as ridiculous as that...

 

Jeanquev said: ↑
Also im not sure being a hofer automatically makes you elite.

I have mixed feelings on this. My gut reaction is to say every HOFer is elite. But there are definitely guys that had great careers without ever being elite at their position.

As much as I loved him and he's one of my favorite players ever....I don't think Dan Hampton was ever elite. He was always very good and played with a mean streak and did a lot of the dirty work. But I don't know if I ever would have called him an elite defensive lineman.

 

The term "elite" is always gonna bring conversation...

If we can't even agree that HoFers were elite, then wth are we doing? lol!

To me "elite" can be determined fairly simple. Were you among the best in the business during the time you played? If the answer is yes, then how can someone say he wasn't elite?

 

I guess that's the rub...the term means something different to everyone.

Does one season of being at the top statistically make a player elite? Do you have to lead the league in some category? Is it individual only or does what the team does in the W/L column factor in? How many players at each position can rationally be considered elite? Is there a limit?

It's all subjective and opinion, obviously. For me....you have to perform among the best at your position for more than 1 season to even get in the conversation. And your actual ability can be weighted against your statistical production as well as the effects of playing on whatever team you're on...some guys benefit from who they play for and some guys can suffer. That would all play a role in my book.

For me....I would consider the top 5 guys at a given position to be the elite...or at least 1st tier elite. And that opens the door for players to be HOFers but not elite.

It's a good conversation and everyone is going to have a different view of it.

 

Sure, I'm fine with breaking it into tiers. That's cool...

FTR, I don't feel like a guy had to be in the HoF to be elite. Not at all...Was Bo Jackson elite? Just throwing a name out there.

A guy I always mention when this discussion comes up is one of my favorite DT's to ever play in this league. To this day, I swear nobody ever had a quicker first step, or more disruptive push up the middle, than Michael Dean Perry...I think he was 3 time all pro. To my knowledge, he's never been in the HoF conversation, but for a time, he was the best in the game, and absolutely among the truly elite players...Just an example. I'm sure there are many others...