BROWNS/JETS....Game 3 Thread

Anybody catch Troy Aikman last night echo EXACTLY what I've been saying the last few weeks? (i know ya did)....

Aikman: "i know John Dorsey and the Browns wanted to handle this QB situation here similarly to the way they handled Patrick Mahomes in KC, but......well this is nothing against Tyrod Taylor, but he's no Alex Smith. It's time for Mayfield in Cleveland."

 

Let us never forget:

2016
1st - Corey Coleman
2nd - Emmanuel Ogbah
3rd - Carl Nassib
3rd - Shon Coleman
3rd - Cody Kessler
4th - Joe Schobert
4th - Ricardo Louis
4th - Derrick Kindred
4th - Seth DeValve
5th - Jordan Payton
5th - Spencer Drango
5th - Rashard Higgins
5th - Trey Caldwell
7th - Scooby Wright

2017
1st - Myles Garrett
1st - Jabrill Peppers
1st - David Njoku
2nd - DeShone Kizer
3rd - Larry Ogunjobi
4th - Howard Wilson
5th - Roderick Johnson
6th - Caleb Brantley
7th - Zane Gonzalez
7th - Matthew Dayes

We have to remind ourselves not to forget, because with so few of those players still in Browns uniforms or meaningfully contributing, it's awfully easy to forget.

Draft picks usually take a few years before they can be seen as having been successful or not - generally until the third or fourth season has been completed, on average. That's why it's even more jarring to see so many of Sashi's draft picks as proven failures so quickly.

During Sashi Brown's tenure, the Cleveland Browns won, what, 1 game (I forget the exact timeline)? 1 win. Why anyone in their right mind would thank Sashi Brown, or even remotely believe him to have been good for this team, is beyond me. It defies all logic.

As I said earlier - just look forwards, don't look backwards. There's nothing good back there.

 

^^^@SAS


(This should be fun.)

 

Hah!!!!! I've got it finally.......He shall from here on be known as Greg The Leg.......

 

lol! The NFL already has one of those Doug:

 

I've found that he has very little of value to say, and is never interested in constructive conversation that might not go his way. So I wouldn't get too excited. Today is also about all the time I'll probably have until gametime Sunday, or past that, so I probably won't be able to hold up my end either.

I would be interested in your response, however, since it's the position you took that I was addressing (others might share it, sure).

 

Dammit!!!!!!!!!

The hunt for a nickname continues.......

 

Now this is what I'm talkin about....

Browns’ rookie Denzel Ward piloting a ‘No Fly Zone’ in Cleveland
BY AUSTIN GAYLE • SEP 21, 2018

Thursday night was all about Baker Mayfield, but the man picked just three spots after the superstar signal-caller isn’t playing like an afterthought. Cleveland Browns rookie cornerback Denzel Ward, a local Ohio State product, is leading a revolution on the defensive side of the ball, turning the doormat that was the team’s secondary into a formidable unit – a No Fly Zone.

Matching Mayfield’s heroics stride for stride, Ward allowed New York Jetsrookie quarterback Sam Darnold to complete just two-of-four targets for eight yards into his coverage in Thursday’s contest. He also logged four combined tackles and one defensive stop, all coming together to form his team-high 90.9 overall grade and 91.4 coverage grade.

Jets wide receiver Robby Anderson did beat Ward for a 17-yard gain in the game, but Ward’s tackle of tight end Chris Herndon eight yards behind the line of scrimmage bit back at his yards allowed and counted as his lone defensive stop on the night. Darnold’s other two targets into Ward’s coverage, which fell incomplete, were intended for wide receiver Jermaine Kearse and tight end Jordan Leggett.

Now three games, 202 defensive snaps into his NFL career, Ward has earned an overall grade of 81.9, which currently ranks eighth among cornerbacks, and a coverage grade of 86.3, which is good for sixth. He has allowed receptions on 15-of-21 targets for 130 yards, two touchdowns, and six first downs while logging two interceptions across 117 coverage snaps. He ranks 31st in passer rating allowed (79.6) and 22nd in yards allowed per reception (8.7).

Ward’s 81.9 overall grade ranks second on Cleveland’s defense coming off their win on Thursday night, as edge defender Myles Garrett (86.0) leads the team at first. Garrett’s and Genard Avery‘s play up front has played into Ward, and the rest of the Browns’ secondary in coverage, as Garrett (7) and Avery (6) have combined for 13 total pressures in three games. Also feeding off the attention drawn to the Browns’ edge tandem, second-year interior defensive lineman Larry Ogunjobi leads the team in total pressures with 11. Cleveland’s defense had just 18 pressures through Week 3 in 2017; three games into the 2018 season, the Browns have totaled a whopping 41 pressures.

Behind Ward, veterans T.J. Carrie and Terrance Mitchell, who were both signed as free agents this offseason, have not been disappointments either, as the duo has allowed just 182 receiving yards and one touchdown between them. Also, Mitchell came down with what went on to be the game-clinching interception against the Jets on Thursday. Factor in athletic third-year linebacker Joe Schobert, who has recorded an 84.3 coverage grade in three games, and the Browns’ ability to defend the pass – from pass-rush to coverage – is marching toward being one of the best in the league.

 

2016
2nd - Emmanuel Ogbah- stud when healthy
4th - Joe Schobert- stud
4th - Derrick Kindred- major contributor, splits snaps with Peppers
5th - Rashard Higgins- #3 WR, looking like a nice contributor

2017
1st - Myles Garrett- STUD and a Half
1st - Jabrill Peppers- Starter, splits with Kindred
1st - David Njoku- starter, looked a helluva lot better with Baker in there
3rd - Larry Ogunjobi- STUD and a Half

How many other teams added that many major contributors over a 2 year period? The list above me, all of those players would be starters on at least half the NFL rosters in the league. He also purged this team of over priced players that were no longer contributing and left a war chest for John Dorsey to make this team an immediate contender for the playoffs...as long as Baker Mayfield is starting




4th - Seth DeValve- too many injuries to have an opinion at this time
4th - Howard Wilson- for the second consecutive year, we will have to wait due to a season ending injury. I can't remember if his college days were filled with injuries, but I can't write him off until the Browns do. There is a reason they are keeping him around after two major injuries.

 

Absolutely! We don't talk enough about this guy...That was a great 4th round pick.

...And I think we got another gem in Genard Avery...

 

Yes, we didn't even talk about the ammunition Sashi gave John to build this team right THIS off season.

I will always be grateful to Sashi, but I am much more confident in Dorsey's talent evaluation.

 

The problem we have, Irish, is that we simply see different realities. I say Mayfield threw a ball into the dirt, you say he was leading a receiver.

Your evaluations of the given players differ from mine. Let's just say that Rashard Higgins is the #3 receiver in a bad group of receivers (I know, pearl-clutching for those that kept saying this was maybe the best in the league, at the start of the year), and therefore isn't really a "successful" draft pick. Nor, importantly, would he start on "half the teams in the league" as you claim.

Myles Garrett should be a stud - he was the first overall pick, and was such an obvious choice that fans here were terrified he wouldn't be the selection. And that leads into the important point: everyone gives credit to Brown for giving this team draft picks, but many here fail to recognize how absolutely awful he was at utilizing them.

8 players in 2 drafts, you picked out as positive contributors to a bad team (until the team proves otherwise). Considering how many shots Brown had, it would be statistically unlikely that he did any worse, especially considering how many of those picks were first rounders, or otherwise highly valuable.

Again, how anyone could attribute the team's current success to Sashi Brown is beyond me (and "success" is relative).

But hey, if you (not you, another poster) want to turn the team winning as many games in 3 tries as they did in 32 under Brown's tenure into a praise of Brown and what he did for the team, then that's fine. My intent was to point at how this should be a celebration of the current team, and not a praise of someone who is distinctly undeserving.

 

Simple . . .

Gump

 

Which is why any of these arguments you are trying to start are a moot point. We don't have anything to discuss until reality hits and we see what they are in a few seasons.

 

I don't think that's the case, in this context. Neither does the poster who originally alleged that Sashi Brown is to thank for putting this team into position to win. That's what my argument was debunking.

 

He is a contributor, that's all he said, and I agree. No one has said that he will be the only reason this team turns the corner, even SAS.

 

The above is not what I alleged, or alleged that the original poster said. You clearly have misunderstood me.

Further, this is what I was addressing:

Again, your reality is not reality. I will try to remember that for the future.

 

I think the two of you should be able to agree with each other for the most part.

1. Sashi Brown was a big reason the Browns had as many draft picks as they have had in recent drafts, and from the above list, he picked some very talented players. Those players have a hand in Cleveland looking good right now

2. Sashi Brown should have selected more impact players than he did with the haul he's had.

 

I contend you don't understand what TD was eluding to with Sashi Brown. He took everything that was wrong out of the equation and did it, most likely, knowing that there would be a couple of years of losing. He also sabotaged a trade that Hue Jackson tried to make to send second round picks to a division rival for a QB that is worse than Tyrod Taylor...And no, I'm not going to debate these two QBs just to amuse you.

He played an important role in what was a perpetual revolving door of cookie cutter GMs coming in and trying to fix a broken roster. He tore it down to the studs and gave John Dorsey a few key pieces, along with what seemed to be unlimited capital to build it the right way...we will see if it is on the way, but I think it is.

 

"Most" is the part that might get you, here.

I agree. Using that information, I can further inform the opinion that Sashi Brown was not a successful GM. Further, in context of the original allegation and my reply to it, Sashi Brown is not responsible for building this team in a way that was inherently set up to win.

For the simpler audience:

Did I say that he did no good things? I did not say that. He did good things. Did he do things better than you'd expect a half-way competent GM to? No, he did not. Giving him praise doesn't resolve with logic or reason. But, as I originally said, Cleveland won, so let's look forward.