Greatest you have seen

Excellent choice, sir. Warren Moon was one of my all time favorites.

 

I have watched a lot of RB's play over the years and I can see why someone would name Sweetness as the GOAT. Personally, I have Payton and Sanders as a very close 2a and 2b.

Remember this, though . . . Virtually every RB discussed here was (what used to be called) a halfback or tailback. Jim Brown did what he did playing Fullback and, as such, there was always another RB option on the field so his blocking backs were generally smaller and fleet of foot.

 

QB: Brady/Montana
RB: Walter Payton (Brown played until 1965; I was born on the first day of the 1964 season, so I can't rightfully say I saw him play)
WR: Jerry Rice

Edit: Gonzo at TE for me.

 

TE's and WR's are a relatively recent developement. Up until around the mid-60's, there was a Tight End who was, in essence, another Tackle and a Split End. (Most teams used the T-formation with the QB under center, two halfbacks, a fullback, a tight end and a split end.) Receiving options on a pass play were basically one split end and one halfback. Tight Ends were rarely called upon to actually catch a pass. I ought to know. I played the tight end postion and couldn't catch the clap in a Tiajuana whorehouse.

It was about the same time (mid 60's), that the passing game started to evolve into what you see today. That said, it makes it even more remarkable to see the numbers put up by players such as Don Hutson, Max Speedy, et al as they played in an era where the defense only had to account for one or two receivers on any given play. Mike Ditka is a HOF tight end. He's probably one of the first TE's to contribute to the passing game but he was mainly a devastating blocker.

So, it's tough for me to come up with a GOAT for either of these two positions (or QB for that matter) because of the vast differences in the game from the "dusty" years to today but, if I had to pick a TE, it would probably be Tony Gonzales. He could have excelled in any era. The same goes for Jerry Rice.

I'll have to think a bit more on QB.

 

Ohh ya, the guys whose offense put up 3 points in the second half while Frank Riechs put up 38 for the 3 point OT playoff win. Tom Brady wouldn't allow that to happen running the Delaware Wing T with the 1990 version of the Patriots. Therein lies the difference from a great statistical QB and the greatest we've all ever watched.

 

Aside from career longevity I dont know how anyone can think Gronk isnt the greatest TE in history.
He's a better blocker than some of the OTs he lines up next to. You wanna talk about being able to excel in any era, he couldve probably played any position in the old days.
His receiving numbers per game crush everyone else's.

 

Actually, it was 10 points in the second half playing in Buffalo, but I'm pretty sure Warren wasn't playing defense when the Oilers gave up 28 points in the third quarter.

But I'd rather talk about Brady only putting up 7 points the entire second half, at home, against the Ravens. I guess it did match the point total that he put up in the first half so, at least he has that going for him...

^^And the point of that is, it's not a pissing contest. The question was asked and I gave my answer, one that hasn't changed in several years.

You can feel disrespected all you want, but this is my personal choice.

 

The only two tight ends you could really argue as being in the conversation with Gronk would be Tony Gonzalez and Shannon Sharpe, but as great as those guys were, neither of them could simply overpower defenders in multiple ways like Gronkowski.

His physical capability and body of work can't be matched at the position.

 

I'm breaking mine down into two categories:

Players that played their positions well and FOOTBALL PLAYERs who played certain positions.

Specialists at their position, who I think did it better than anyone else to player their position:

QB: Joe Montana, honestly, he was poetry in motion. He had an ability to know what was happening on the field before he said hut. Brady is a close second.
RB: Barry Sanders, as an individual skill set, Barry Sanders could do thing no other human could do, let alone a RB
WR: Jerry Rice, He worked hard to know his position so well that no one has even come close to him, before he played or since. He may never be touched as a pure WR. Some may end up with better numbers over the sands of time change the game, but if he were playing today in his prime, he would be averaging 2,000 yards per season and 25 TDs.
TE: Tony Gonzalez, The man had the best hands I have personally seen at TE. He made circus catches like a WR, while being in a TE body.


Pure Football Players, who played these positions:

QB: Brett Favre was THE best football player I have ever see. His raw determination, which is something needed to win me over in this category, was unmatched by anyone I personally witnessed.
RB: I am going to take a step back here and go off of tapes I have seen of him running. No RB in the history of the game was more of a football player than Jim Brown. I don't agree with the person he was off the field, but that man was born to play this great game. It wasn't because of his special skills he developed to enhance his position, he could have played LB and he would have been the best LB to ever play.
WR: Jerry Rice, this is why no one may ever touch Rice as the best ever WR. He had the football player mentality. If he wasn't in on a passing route, he was blocking like a TE. He wanted to effect every single offensive play, he didn't have to be the showcase of that play. His tenacity was infectious.
TE: Ozzie Newsome, again, he is one of the best TEs, but he wasn't the best. They way he played the game though, is what carries him through life. There is no down time for the man, whether it was blocking for Mike Pruitt and Earnest Byner, or catching a game winning TD, he left everything on the field every game of his career. Then he immediately went into finding yet another way to help this game be a better game in the front office. This man has had no neutral speed in his career. He is long over due for a break from the game and I personally hope he enjoys his retirement.

 

exactly.

I understand the longevity aspect certainly isnt in Gronk's favor but when he's on the field, forget it. bigger than the others in the conversation, dwarfs Sharpe actually.
me rambling.....what you already stated, physically superior.

 

You know, he is so "new" I didn't give him thought...but I couldn't argue your point...and in reality he could be argued for both of my personal "categories" because that man is a FOOTBALL PLAYER. He could have picked any number of positions and succeeded.

I will respectively agree with you here..

 

The Oilers defense scored 7 on a Thurman Thomas fumble to start the second half.

 

I'm having a hard time picking a receiver.

I understand all of the arguments for Rice and I won't try to downplay them.

I keep coming back to the idea of guys with physical skill sets that are overwhelming, combined with route running and excellent hands being the kind of player that I want to take to answer this question. Calvin Johnson, Larry Fitzgerald, Sterling Sharpe and, believe it or not, Brandon Marshall all come to mind for me here.

Running back and tight end were easy for me, but this is proving to be a lot harder.

I'm not sure that we are not in the middle of watching two of the greatest to ever play the position emerge right now in Odell Beckham Jr. and Michael Thomas.

 

lol

Fair enough. I only looked at the quick box score.

 

That's ok, truth be told. I only knew that because I watched the 30 for30, 4 Falls of Buffalo last night.

 

This is a tough conversation because I'm in my 20's and have a terrible fucking memory. That, and most of my earlier football exposure was Chicago and Miami, with trickles of other teams when I wasn't working in the yard on Sundays. So, I'm lacking in both material and recollection. When asked questions like this (and it was a good one, firehalo), my mind immediately snaps to one thing:

Devin Hester was the most exciting football player I've ever watched.

Sure, there have been other guys who are so outstandingly electric that they make you jump to your feet when they break a big play. But Devin had entire buildings in anticipation, before a ball was even snapped. His presence itself was electric. That's a feeling that the game has never otherwise been able to reproduce for me, and one that I'll always be bitter isn't still around.

It might have helped, being a Bears fan. Did I mention I'm probably biased? Oh, well. I mean it with every word, and I think I'd say the same regardless of the fanbase I claimed. Devin Hester was absolutely ridiculous.

 

It was tough picking Tony G over Gronk. Ask me again in a couple years and the answer is probably different.

 

Just had this conversation about a month ago with someone that agrees with you.

My favorite return man of all time is Dante Hall.

We argued this over many beers and finally came to the conclusion that he should just shut up and agree with me before I kicked his ass and drank his beer.

He remembers it differently.

 

That's a good part of the reason why I personally don't have him at #1 (yet).

Availability is another. In 17 years, Gonzo missed TWO games; Gronk's missed 26 in 8 years.

Lastly, I just can't dismiss 1,325 receptions, 15,000+ yards and 111 TDs.

 

I'll try to take a stab at this. Its difficult to just narrow it down to one player at one position. There were so many who were great in different era's. Ive seen a couple era's, I guess, as I was born the same year as the Minnesota Vikings. (1961)

QB = Montana... honorable mention to Brady
RB = Faulk... honorable mentions to Sanders and Payton.
WR = Moss... Rice wasn't too shabby either.
TE = Gronkowski
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We should do the defense too. There are a ton of football playing monsters on that side of the ball also.

Lawrance Taylor and Reggie White are the a couple right off the top of my head... and as I write this I think of Lott also... so many great's we've seen.

Damn man, I miss football...