I understand what you're saying here, but again, there's little to be gained. The Giants will still have the same decision. Either trade with the Browns to ensure they get Sam Darnold, or sit at #2 and let Cleveland make that decision for them. The only way to guarantee that they get Sam, if that is truly the top player on their board, is to make that trade with Cleveland. If they are convinced he is the franchise quarterback of the future then they will be willing to make that deal regardless of what rumors come out of Berea. If New York feels like Sam Darnold is worth trading up one spot in the draft (player being commensurate with the price that Cleveland is charging) then they will try to make that deal. If not, they will simply let Cleveland make that decision for them. I'm not sure that the Giants are going to be willing to take that deal from the Bills. It's been reported that Chubb is considered the safest prospect in the draft by many and Gettleman has no history of trading down. He can simply sit at two and draft a marquee player instead of risking a trade down that sees him drafting out of the top 10.
I think you can sleep sound without that being a worry. Baker may end up going in the top 4, but I don't believe the Giants would pass on Darnold if they have the opportunity to move up.
Okay, so here's where it gets interesting... Per Allbright, Giants have interest in Bradley Chubb and Sam Darnold Also per Allbright, he thinks Browns draft Sam Darnold at #1 Lastly, per Allbright, he thinks Chubb doesn't make it past Cleveland at #4 Per Tony Pauline (and others), Giants/Bills have a trade framework in place for #2 pick Today, Bradley Chubb revealed the Browns didn't schedule a meeting with him (odd, but doesn't completely mean no interest) On the surface, it looks like Darnold/Chubb would be logical picks for Cleveland, with New York trading out of #2 (with Darnold gone) to a team that values either Mayfield or Rosen since either would be the likely pick (many reporting the Jets would take Mayfield at #3). HOWEVER... Having a QB available at #4 for the Browns to then trade out of (say, with Buffalo again) to jump teams like Denver (#5) and Miami (#11) nets the Browns more picks - *and* would seem to match more of the in-house visits we've seen them conduct (guys like Ward and Hurst who are 10-15 type guys). If Cleveland let's Darnold go to New York (Giants) they can create more draft capital for themselves. If the Browns want Mayfield, they must take him at #1 since the Jets would take him at #3. If the Browns disguise that interest now (Josh Allen), they force the Giants to make the move while they're on the clock versus ahead of time.
^^^^^ OR... If the Browns truly do value all quarterbacks the same (unlikely), then you take Chubb at #1, the New York's take Darnold and Mayfield respectively and the Browns get Josh Rosen at #4.
Great article written on Josh Allen: link. Bottom line... Allen comps: Jake Locker, Patrick Ramsey, Kyle Boller, Blaine Gabbert, and Mark Sanchez. Mayfield comps: Ben Roethsliberger, Peyton Manning, Russell Wilson, and Aaron Rodgers.
Because Tom Brady is and was the ultimate historical outlier? Tom Brady's college stats were nothing noteworthy and even the guy who drafted him was debating between Brady and Tim Rattay when they were on the clock. The fact is, one of the analytic predictors for QB success lauds Mayfield - he scored the fourth highest since 1997 (I assume that's as far back as they went into the data): All of this has to be part of the evaluation process and that's mainly what the article was about. Do the Browns, the most snake-bitten NFL franchise possibly ever (at least modern era) and a team who haven't had a decent quarterback since Kosar take a guy whom every single marker besides (1) arm strength, (2) build, and (3) mobility point to being a flop at the next level? Add in the "fit" component in Cleveland. Even Allen's own coaches have said he needs to sit for at least a year at the next level. The Browns haven't allowed a first round QB to sit ever. Even Quinn saw relief duty as a rookie during a couple drives when Anderson was hurt. Instead, we have Hue Jackson who's 1-31, wrecked two rookie QBs already and is probably on borrowed time as is. Behind him is Todd Haley who's flopped as a head coach or a potential new candidate in 2019 if (or when) Hue is fired? So you're talking about a potential coaching overhaul, new systems, new structures, etc. Cleveland might be the worst possible destination for a guy like Josh Allen.
Honestly, I don't think it matters where he lands. He is the least likely to succeed from my evaluations..Even in New England, I wouldn't have a lot of hope sitting behind Tom Brady for 4 years.
SAS I truly hope that the last statement is "taken care of" with the addition of Taylor and Stanton, and hiring an independent minded OC. If Hue is the one responsible for the rookie's development, then God help us. I think you are right on the money: if the pressure to win is making the HC feel he has to make the move to the rookie to save his job, then I would hope, he loses his job, rather than use the rookie as a liferaft. It would appear that Dorsey has built in protection for the rookie, with the moves made so far, and has a plan. If the HC isn't on board, then the power struggle begins, and IMO Dorsey holds the cards, and will prevail. Plus Dorsey gets all this year and next to show "his plan" is better, whereas Hue is already on borrowed time. Hue's "new job" as Head Coach is in it's first year. I can't defend his "coaching" over the past two seasons, but am still pulling for him to show he can do it. Continuity is important, and while changing HC may not mean a total overhaul, it certainly means change, once again, and change hasn't been our friend in recent history. I'm hoping he can level up, let go of some of his "comfortable" former rolls, and be a unifying force for his coaching staff, while letting them do their jobs. Hope. It's all a Browns fan has to cling to. So I do.
As for which guy to take as QB. No one cars who or what I think, so what I "hope", is that Dorsey & Co decide who they want and don't allow any other team the opportunity to scuttle that pick, by getting "cute" with draft day moves. Once you have your guy, OK, get creative, or get the next guy you have as BPA. No regrets this time.
They're trading up for Lamar Jackson. So the general thought with Jackson is he doesn't make it past Los Angeles Chargers at #17 but the newest name in the ring is Baltimore (sitting at #16). It makes a ton of sense since Joe Flacco is an expensive garbage fire and they just signed Bob Griffin who, if healthy, can be the guinea pig for what an offense helmed by Jackson might look like.
That's the thing. One thing I think all Browns fans could agree on... Would you rather have Dorsey making the decision or a couple guys on L4SN message board? You either have confidence in Dorsey or you don't.
As long as it isn't Allen, then my answer is Dorsey...If it's Allen, then I have to re-think having any trust at all in the guy as an evaluator. Allen is CLEARLY not the best available QB, let alone player available in the entire draft..so, no way should he be the #1 overall pick of that draft. He's just a guy that can throw a ball 80 yards. I have watched a LOT of film on all the QBs, Allen isn't even close...
C'mon Irish you've been wrong way more than you've been right in here - just like the rest of us. You really think you can evaluate QBs better than Dorsey? That's silly. I listened to Pat Kirwan and Jim Miller for about an hour yesterday (they absolutely love Mayfield btw) and they talked about how in every one of their mocks, regardless of who was choosing they have given the Browns Allen and they explained it pretty well. I could never do it justice but they spent the entire week in Mobile with Allen and Mayfield and they basically said when it comes down to it you just can't pass on what Josh Allen can be, even if you love Mayfield - which they do. They broke Allen down point by point and really described him from a team executive perspective and why the average person couldn't see it the way teams do.
I was harsh in saying he's just a guy that can throw 80 yards..Obviously that's not true. But everything that is needed to form him into a viable QB is historically a pipe dream. I have seen better prospects than him come through with similar aspirations and fail miserably. If he had shown some sense of consistency in growth, I may feel different. I personally think he should have stayed in school another year, but apparently I am on an island in thinking that. If he is going top ten, then he made the right decision to leave. The sooner he gets professional coaching the better off he is...That is one experiment I want to stay far far away from though. The negatives far outweigh the positives at this point, you just can't pick a player like that at #1 overall.
We aren't talking about evaluating every player and predicting what their career will be 10 years from now, we are talking about evaluating and stating which QB out of the class is the best at this moment in time...not every QB, the ONE QB that stands above the others. So, I beg to differ, I have been pretty damn accurate from that standpoint, picking the one guy I think is better than the rest. Where's the pat yourself on the back emoji Tim? We all miss on the guys that fall into the perfect situation and are taken later in the draft. There is no way of knowing their situation prior to the draft taking place. Pretty obvious the Browns aren't an organization that is totally put together on both sides of the ball and just need someone who will come in and not mess up, which in turn makes them look like damn good QBs. We need a guy who will mold the offense into something THEY will lead into the future. My money is on Mayfield after watching hours and hours of film on all these guys. I understand his height will most likely keep him from becoming the #1 overall pick. It doesn't change my evaluation of him. My hope at this point, if they don't take Mayfield is that they stay with the safe pick in Sam Darnold. He is a guy who COULD step into a situation like Dak Prescott had in Dallas and run an offense that will win games. I don't think he is a savior, but he will be a consummate pro, imho.
I'll add it to the list for updated smiles. Should be available post-draft, just in time for all of us to give ourselves an 'attaboy'.
