Where Do We Go From Here?

Discussion in 'Cleveland Browns' started by TopDawg, Oct 2, 2017.

  1. You have a better chance of Barkley at #1 than Mayfeld and that's a 1% chance
     
  2. SAS M.V.P. Rams Chargers

    I'm not sure what that means... are you saying it's more likely we draft Barkley at No. 1 overall than Mayfield... and that's it's not likely we draft Barkley?

    Or that we should draft Barkley at #1 and hope to get Mayfield at #3?
     
  3. Your 1st sentence is correct
     
  4. SAS M.V.P. Rams Chargers

    Hue Jackson on DeShone Kizer (a timeline):

    upload_2017-12-20_16-36-7.png
    upload_2017-12-20_16-36-32.png

     
  5. TopDawg Legend

    I like Mayfield, but because I also liked Johnny, I take nothing but shit for even mentioning Mayfield's name...In the eyes of most Ohioans, they are the same guy evidently...

    I don't think that is the case, but I'm already sick of trying to defend Mayfield against that comparison. I know that much....
     
    LAOJoe, IrishDawg42 and SAS like this.
  6. SAS M.V.P. Rams Chargers

    I guess it would depend on the price. I do think the Browns could upgrade the position, but it's also tough to grade out Crowell accurately because the coaches are so poor. Something that even Crowell took notice of recently:

    [​IMG]

    Overall, he disappears too much in games for my liking and hasn't proven to be a reliable guy. His overall YPC numbers are inflated by a couple big runs - although less this year than most. He's on pace for 900 yards this season, a letdown from last year and he's still never eclipsed 1,000 yards in a season.

    In this year's draft, I have the following players as clear-cut upgrades at the position:
    • Saquon Barkley
    • Derrius Guice
    • Ty Montgomery
    • Sony Michel
    • Damien Harris
    That's as primary "every-down" backs. I think a guy like Ronald Jones as an upgrade, although differently - not an every-down back but a true 1-2 combination with Johnson.

    Now, Crowell's playing on a $2.75 million RFA tender, so what's his market value? The running back market is incredibly soft, with the best guys getting an average of $8.25 million a season. Crowell is certainly not in the Top 10 or 15 when discussing the position. He's 16th right now in terms of rushing yards and tied for 52nd in rushing touchdowns. Overall, 24th in total yards from scrimmage.

    Carlos Hyde is probably the closest comp - fourth year guy, simliarly aged (25 - Hyde, 24 - Crowell). Crowell has had more rushing yards and totals 3,824 total yards from scrimmage in his career. Hyde is 3,192. Touchdowns are dead even (22 - Crowell, 21 - Hyde). Hyde's market value is estimated as $6.1 million a season.

    Crowell, a somewhat polarizing player with up-and-down production signing a 4-year, $24.6 million dollar deal ($12.5 million guaranteed)? By comparison sake, Leonard Fournette (the fourth overall pick - similar to where Barkley would be taken) got 4-year, $27 million (fully guaranteed) - plus club option for the fifth season.
     
  7. Ty Montgomery?
     
  8. SAS M.V.P. Rams Chargers

    People who compare Mayfield and Manziel as anything other than electrifying, Heisman-winning college quarterbacks are either jaded by what Manziel did to the team, or dopes. From a player and prospect perspective, they're completely opposite players.

    Manziel was an outside the pocket passer with uncanny field awareness and mobility, a deadly runner from the position. His arm was above average, but not great, and he took most of his shots to the boundary (where he had 6'5" Mike Evans out-jumping college defensive backs for 50/50 balls). Manziel had a ton of charisma and leadership quality, but also had a very dark personal side that he could not control.

    Mayfield is also elite outside the pocket, but top-notch from within the confines as well. He uses his field awareness and mobility to extend plays and make them in the passing game. Despite plus-mobility in the running game, he's never been a run-heavy or run-first quarterback. He's built completely different, although they're both about 6'1". Mayfield is a lot thicker which a much bigger lower body and thighs. Manziel wore a flak jacket and still looked skinny. Mayfield wears standard rib protectors and looks like he chops wood for a living. His arm is much better than Manziel's and he attacks the field at all levels, less to the boundary than Manziel. He also possesses rare confidence/charisma, but by all accounts doesn't have a wild, personal side to him.

    upload_2017-12-20_17-7-56.png

    upload_2017-12-20_17-10-4.png

    I also wanted Manziel in 2014, a large part because of his "it factor". In 2015, when he got the chance to start, he went 2-4 (so double Hue Jackson's win count). His stat line:

    122 of 212 (57.5%), 1,461 yards (208.7 YPG), 7 TD (3.3%), 5 INT (2.4%), 79.4 QB rating plus 32.9 rush YPG

    By comparison sake, DeShone Kizer (who wasn't high, drunk, or both like Johnny) went:

    221 of 410 (53.9%), 2,398 yards (184.5 YPG), 9 TD (2.2%), 19 INT (4.6%), 59.4 QB rating plus 26.9 rush YPG
     
    Last edited: Dec 20, 2017
    TopDawg likes this.
  9. SAS M.V.P. Rams Chargers

    David Montgomery (ISU), not the Green Bay Packer. Typo.
     
  10. LAOJoe Assistant Coach Manager Patreon Silver Maple Leafs Eagles

    That is from last October vs the Cowboys.
     
  11. TopDawg Legend

    It might have been staged. You never actually see the slam of the TV....I have a 47 inch flat screen sitting in my garage right now with a busted lightboard, and I could've staged a similar video using that, at no expense. Though if I'm just trying for laughs or clicks in a video like that, I'm not involving young children in it.... So perhaps it is genuine...Either way, the dude is an idiot.
     
  12. In a H2H matchup on 12/30 I will take my higher rated RB Gaskin(didnt make your list) over Barkley
     
  13. IrishDawg42 Legend Manager Browns Buckeyes Fighting Irish

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    Last edited: Dec 21, 2017
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  14. IrishDawg42 Legend Manager Browns Buckeyes Fighting Irish

    Honestly kenibals, I don't think Crow is even considering staying in Cleveland. He was looking for a payday and Hue Jackson single handily took the opportunity away by not giving him carries. Crow has a temperament that I believe will lead him fast and hard away from Cleveland.
     
  15. SAS M.V.P. Rams Chargers

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  16. SAS M.V.P. Rams Chargers

    #FireHue
     
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  17. SAS M.V.P. Rams Chargers

    #FireHue

    Every name on that list is a massive upgrade.
     
  18. TopDawg Legend

    That's hard to believe, until you watch Kizer play, and see how Hue calls the games. I mean you gotta score to win, and we've only topped 18 points three times. One of those was in Detroit where we still lost by 14, and another was when we got a couple garbage scores at Indy to make it seem much closer than it was...It's crazy that we are 0-14 (again) but it's richly deserved. Kizer is lost. He needs to sit and learn. And Hue just sucks...There's just no possible way to win with this combo.

    The defense isn't great, but they played good enough for us to win several games. There will probably be playoff teams with comparable defenses....I just don't know how much stock I put in that stat. We could literally throw up a wall that would be effective against the run too, but not much help if the QB can simply toss it over to open WR's running right through the rarely guarded middle of the secondary...
     
    IrishDawg42 likes this.
  19. TopDawg Legend

    Even so...No Shurmur again.
    [​IMG]
     
  20. TopDawg Legend

    I'd probably prefer McDaniels, Vrabel or Jim Bob....in that order.
     

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