Where Do We Go From Here?

Discussion in 'Cleveland Browns' started by TopDawg, Oct 2, 2017.

  1. TopDawg Legend

    IMO The best rookie RB might actually be Alvin Kamara....That guy is a beast. Talk about a smooth stride, Kamara is fun to watch. Explosive RB. He can take it and score from anywhere. Awesome in the passing game. Tremendous weapon for New Orleans...

    Not much good to say about Cleveland , as usual. What the heck happened to the Browns run defense? The Bengals just owned them yesterday. Cinci has struggled to run the football all season, but didn't have much problem against us. That was probably Mixon's best game...

    Our kicker is atrocious. We might as well just go for it from now on, rather than sending Gonzalez out there. Tough to win a football game when you have major breakdowns offensively, defensively and on special teams...
     
    SAS likes this.
  2. Kamara is playing some good football
     
  3. SAS M.V.P. Rams Chargers

    This is completely asinine. Alex Smith, despite a poor game, is still the second-highest rated QB in 2017. The only one higher is Tom Brady who's such a guaranteed lock for the Hall of Fame that they're giving him two busts.

    Alex Smith is playing great football right now. The team is losing football games.

    #PigeonChess #DoYouEvenFootballBro
     
  4. He just led his team to 10 pts at home after LAC just scored 54 pts on the same defense.....he is in jeopardy of losing his job but hes playing great :confused:
     
  5. beachbum M.V.P. Manager Steelers

    When I threw out the very unpopular opinion that the Steelers shouldn't franchise Leveon Bell and instead try to sign him long term this was the guy I targeted in Round 2 as a backup plan, along with his teammate Dobbs in Round 4. Helluva talent.
     
    TopDawg likes this.
  6. TopDawg Legend

    He reminds me a little bit of Marcus Allen...He's a gamebreaker. We passed on him four times. Drafted in the third round, #67. I have no idea why he slid that far. I looked at the rookie RB'a a lot, and I had Kamara pegged for the late first/ early second round area. No doubt the Saints got a steal. They had one of my favorite drafts last year. Marshawn Lattimore, Ryan Ramczyk, Marcus Williams and Alvin Kamara. That's about as good as you can do it. We need an impact draft like that.
     
    beachbum likes this.
  7. TopDawg Legend

    I made sure to get Kamara in both my money fantasy leagues....:bet:
     
    beachbum likes this.
  8. beachbum M.V.P. Manager Steelers

    They've had two great drafts the last two seasons and it shows. Another example of a team turning things around quickly.
     
    TopDawg likes this.
  9. TopDawg Legend

    Whew. I'm glad he's not a Steeler...
     
  10. SAS M.V.P. Rams Chargers

    Where Do We Go From Here? (And Why This Concerns Me...)

    [​IMG]
    Hue Jackson is 9-34 as a head coach and has never won a playoff game as either a coach or coordinator. His reputation as a QB whisperer could not be more embellished and false. His offense is stuck in the late 90's, he refuses to adapt his offense to his players, and he is too stubborn to hire and offensive coordinator and focus on being a head coach (his only other experience as an HC he had his buddy Al Saunders call plays in Oakland).

    He's 1-26 in Cleveland in his time with Cleveland and very much on track to go 0-16 this season... and here's the kicker: it looks as though he's the favorite to survive the offseason purge. Jimmy Haslam seems to be leaning towards Hue at this point -- it was reported earlier in the season that Haslam wanted to bring everyone back but that seems unlikely at this point with losses continuing to mount. Since then, Hue has emerged as "they guy".

    1. This was Jimmy's pick

    Haslam was burned in the past by coaches. His first head coach (Rob Chudzkinski) lasted one season and was no where near his first choice. Banner/Lombardi sold Haslam on getting a better coach and he was forced to settle. His next coach (Mike Pettine) was also no where near his first choice. He was the best of what was left after other coaches either turned them down or took other jobs. Hue Jackson was Haslam's first choice. For that reason alone, he's more likely to stick with him over the legal counsel he promoted to Executive Vice President of Player Personnel.

    2. Jimmy's hearing the wrong things

    From Hue Jackson's media leaks - actively sowing division - to speaking with other coaches/players on gameday they'll all point to the same thing: the coaches are fine and they're missing the talent. "Bring in that football-based GM". He hears that the football guys are either leary or making fun of the "analytics" approach. It's foreign to him and them. The reason they're so young is because of the steps analytics took to build this team - five years worth of drafts in three. If they're let go and a new regime has any luck in the draft, it's not because they were better evaluators - it's because they were setup with a king's ransom in the draft.

    3. The players haven't quit

    Sure... but how have they shown progress? It certainly seems that Jimmy is giving Hue undue credit for the team still being in it and not any (or much) admonition for the regression of some players and failures to develop others. Last season, Al Saunders the WR position coach, took a cast-off quarterback and transformed him into an NFL WR who put together 77 catches, 1,007 yards, and 4 touchdowns. This season, Browns wide receivers have 97 receptions, 1,216 yards, and 3 touchdowns. Regression.

    4. Lack of options

    Blowing the entire thing up only continues to fuel the notion that this is a dumpster fire of an organization and only a hungry, unproven coordinator would be able to step in and take a chance. Jimmy Haslam would have fired four head coaches in five seasons. If the front office stays and the coaching staff departs, the logical belief is that the owner has sided with the F/O and would stick by them. You'd whittle the options down even further to choose from and get some virtual unknown as a coach.

    Ultimately, if this organization blows up the front office and sticks by Hue, we'll be in for a lame duck season and waste a draft haul that this team will have suffered through a potential 0-16 season for. With a "football organization" in place, we're talking heavy spending in free agency for veteran players, trading picks for players, trading up in the draft to target "football evaluated" players with a regime that either will have been assembled a mere four months before the draft (i.e., has not had time to evaluate players fully) or picked by a head coach who's shown zero ability in that department.
     
  11. SAS M.V.P. Rams Chargers

  12. SAS M.V.P. Rams Chargers

    Man... imagine having an HC/OC like this:


    Link.

    Instead, we get:

    [​IMG]
     
    TopDawg likes this.
  13. SAS M.V.P. Rams Chargers

    Of course, if we did have Hue calling audibles, we'd get:

    [​IMG]
     
  14. SAS M.V.P. Rams Chargers

    Mock Draft | Week 12 Update

    Browns lose and move to an imperfect 0-11. Philadelphia and Carolina win again but Kansas City and Houston lose. Draft picks are ranked without supplemental picks.

    For this week, let's assume Jimmy Haslam brings everyone back for the Year 3 make-or-break with some small adjustments. A team president and/or traditional general manager is added to the front office. Hue Jackson is given more say on the players acquired - both in free agency and the draft.

    The first move is to aggressively pursue A.J. McCarron from Cincinnati. Who are the Browns bidding against? McCarron seems more than ready to leave (but let's assume he loses his injunction against the team), so the best they can hope for is the first supplemental pick in 2019 - #97 overall. Hue Jackson gets his way and the Browns trade #42 (f/Houston) and #120 (f/Carolina) for McCarron. Browns sign him to a three year, $50 million dollar deal with $21 million guaranteed.

    This move still leaves the Browns with six picks in the Top 100 choices (most teams only get seven across 255).

    1.1: Baker Mayfield, QB Oklahoma


    How can they not? Even if he's not a traditional QB prospect, the top choices are Mayfield - the best college QB, possibly ever; Rosen - a lean passer with questionable intangibles and relationships with teammates; and Darnold - a fringe second-rounder who could return to school, has already said he doesn't want to play for Cleveland, and makes poor decisions with the football. The other options may force the Browns' hand in this case.

    It should work out because the only QB more efficient in the history of the game than Mayfield (196.4 QB efficiency, 2016) is Mayfield (203.4 QB efficiency, 2017). He's got a strong arm, elite accuracy, the capability to read defenses, the ability to make plays with his legs in, out, and around the pocket, and is a fiery competitor. Mayfield would also be walking into a situation where McCarron and Kizer battle for QB1 to start the season (Hue's familiarity and his veteran status would lead one to believe McCarron is the favorite), so he can be brought along slowly.

    Bottom line: Browns must add a QB with one of their first two picks and waiting around (unless Houston's ends up in the Top 4 selections) is too risky to chance.

    1.7 (f/Houston): Calvin Ridley, WR Alabama

    Corey Coleman has been an extreme disappointment in his time with the team, from multiple off-field issues to multiple games missed due to injury, he just simply hasn't lived up to the billing. When he's on the field, he's an unspectacular 48 receptions for 619 yards (12.9 YPC), 4 TDs, and 45.7 percent catch rate through 15 games. His QB rating when thrown to in 2016 was 65.6 and has regressed to 52.3 in 2017. Kenny Britt, Ricardo Louis, Rashard Higgins, and Sammie Coates are rotational, special teams guys at best.

    For the season, Ridley has 896 yards on 55 catches (16.3 YPC) and 3 TDs. That's in a run-first offense with a running QB under center. What Ridley does best is naturally run all the routes and NFL receiver needs to run and do so with great fluidity. He has a knack for making plays deep and is a reliable catcher (11.1 drop rate).

    Bottom line: Browns WR crop is one of the glaring weaknesses of the team and Ridley immediately infuses it with talent and the ability to become a dominant pass-catcher in this league.

    2.33: Joshua Jackson, FS/CB Iowa

    Jackson is a player who's stock has started to soar after some very good games recently. He's a converted wide receiver to cornerback who, just this season, has notched 18 passes defenced and 7 interceptions - two returned for touchdowns. To give some context, Hooker had 4 passes defensed and 7 interceptions - three returned for touchdowns. Like Desmond King before him, he's a very solid cornerback who's timed speed may mean a shift to free safety for him.

    At either position, Jackson offers a clear upgrade (Taylor, Kindred) and gives the regime flexibility with forgotten 2017 draft pick, Howard Wilson.

    2.42 (f/Houston): TRADED

    2.64 (f/Philadelphia): Brian O'Neill, OT Pitt

    The Browns really, really miss Joe Thomas at offensive tackle. Spencer Drango has been a hot mess, as was the case with his rookie season as well. I don't know that he's going to be able to take the next step and Shon Coleman offers value in the running game but also struggles against NFL-quality pass rushers. Enter, Brian O'Neill.

    O'Neill began his career at Pittsburgh as a tight end, was converted to right tackle, and asked to move to left tackle this season. He's surrendered two QB pressures and no sacks in that time. As a right tackle, he boasted the nation's second-best pass protection grade and he's on track to repeat this season at left tackle. While he doesn't offer the same value in the running game, he's being drafted as the heir apparent to Joe Thomas - who many not have a lot of time left - and protect the QB's blind side.

    3.65: David Montgomery, RB Iowa State

    This team has indicated a strong willingness to avoid drafting running backs early, often to their detriment. Isaiah Crowell is a lost cause at this point and will not be returning to the team. That leaves the under-utilized, multi-purpose Duke Johnson Jr. and Matt Dayes as the only running backs left with NFL carries. Browns should use an early-ish pick on a ball carrier.

    Montgomery is a dual-threat running back with Madden-like juke skills. He goes 5'11" and 220 pounds, so he should hold up at the next level and is a true sophomore running back, so there's a limited number of touches (e.g., less wear-and-tear). While it's unclear if he's doing to declare, he should be one of the more fun guys to watch at the Combine if he does. He broke the NCAA record for missed tackles in a season (89) with 101 and counting.

    4.97: B.J. Hill, DT North Carolina State

    Browns can add some rotational depth along the defensive line in Hill. The run defense was good until the Bengals game and it's the lack of depth that started to erode their success - Meder and Ogbah both missing. Hill is prototypically-sized (6'4" and 315 pounds) and has posted 23.5 TFLs and 8.0 sacks in his career at N.C. State.

    4.120 (f/Carolina): TRADED

    5.129: Adam Breneman, TE Massachusetts

    Being drafted this lowly would be due to the name on the front of the jersey. Breneman is an interesting case - a top-rated recruit out of high school who picked Penn State and was great as a true freshman. Injured as a sophomore and graduated in only three years, he transferred to UMass and sat out a season before playing at a high level there (128 receptions, 1,523 yards, 11 TDs in two seasons). Would give the team another option in the passing game.

    5.150 (f/Kansas City): Cody Thompson, WR Toledo

    The fifth-year senior offers nearly-perfect hands and the ability to generate big plays (averaging 20.0 YPC in his career). He broke his leg in his senior season but should be ready to go for 2018 (although it remains to be seen if he will be ready to compete in the Combine). Thompson has good size (6'2" and 200 pounds) and shiftiness.

    6.161: Dante Booker, OLB Ohio State

    A top-rated high school product who hasn't been healthy during his time at Ohio State. Drafting on talent alone here and hoping he stays healthy, it gives the Browns some depth behind Jamie Collins who's been missed with injury this season. Booker measures 6'3" and 240 pounds and in limited action has notched 39 solo tackles, 6.0 TFLs, 1.0 sacks, and 1 INT (23 games).

    7.193: Daniel Carlson, K Auburn

    It's safe to say that the Zane Gonzalez experiment is not working. Whether the Browns bring in a free agent, grab a UDFA, or spend a late round draft pick on a kicker, competition at the position is a must. Carlson is a big kicker who's averaged 81.8 percent on field goals during his time in Auburn. Bonus: he's had a few punts in his career and his 39.6 average is much better than Gonzalez's current 16.0.
     
  15. SAS M.V.P. Rams Chargers

    Yikes.
     
  16. SAS M.V.P. Rams Chargers


    Friendly reminder the NFL owners approved - and actively encouraged - Jimmy Haslam to join their ranks as owner of the Browns, despite an active FBI investigation into the rebate fraud scheme where Pilot Flying J targeted minority-owned trucking companies.
     
  17. SAS M.V.P. Rams Chargers

    Forget Peyton & Payton... give me Manning & Manning!!
     
  18. Washed up why do you think their benching him lol...did you not see the Thanksgiving day game smh
     
  19. SAS M.V.P. Rams Chargers

    Great leader, great person. Sometimes there's a value to that you can't easily measure with completion percentage.

    And on a team that's refused to give Manning a running game and an offensive line for the past four seasons, a season in which he lost his top three receivers in one game, he's completing 62.5% of his passes, thrown 14 touchdowns to 7 interceptions, and has a QB rating of 84.1. Our starting QB's numbers: 53.3%, 5 touchdowns to 14 interceptions, and a QB rating of 57.2.
     
  20. Well yes if your comparing him to Kizer, he's a world beater
     

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