Bears vs Packers Must Win Game Thread

The issue with Floyd is he’s used in coverage a lot and it takes away his chances to rush the passer.

He’s been very effective in coverage and he’s done a good, not great, job as a pass rusher.

We do need to see more from him but I wouldn’t call drafting him a mistake by any means.

 

Yeah I get Fangio is nothing like Lovie in his approach. It doesn't matter. My point is no matter what his history shows, it would be nice if his defense had a propensity to force turnovers with THIS team, which they have not consistently demonstrated in 3 years. That's a big strike against him in my book. Good for you that you can seemingly not mind this as much.

That's one game I've had in mind, probably the best the defense has looked in the Fangio era. Only to follow that up with one of the worst last week. There's no consistency. One step forward, two steps back all the time. 2015, good games against the Rams and Packers, defense then proceedes to choke against the 49ers and everyone else the rest of the season. 2016, good games against the 49ers, chokes the game away next week against GB, then quits against the Skins and Vikings. 2017, dominant game against the Panthers, decent game against the Saints, then last week happens. If you want to call it progress then you have to admit that it's progress on an epically tiny scale. I'm looking at full body of work the last 3 years, in which the team has a total of 12 wins. The offense has been bad but so has the defense. I'm calling them out now because yes I'm still pissed about last week. And even a win today won't change that.

There haven't been any save for last week because this team rarely has a lead in the 4th quarter. Then, as I went on to say, I still wouldn't trust them with a lead late in the game

Fortunately, we haven't seen this in the Fangio era, maybe once or twice. This was a signature trend in the Tucker era. Sure Fangio is better than Tucker. Doesn't mean I have to like him or what this defense has, or hasn't become in 3 years.

 

I take it you're very pissed off at Dowell Loggains for the fact we aren't slinging it all over opponents every week a la the Patriots. I mean since we aren't paying any attention to personnel or philosophy. Why aren't they Bears throwing for 400yards and 4TD's every week. They should be. Its terrible.

I'd love to see Trubisky lighting teams up every week exactly like Deshaun Watson was, but i understand the reasons why he isn't. So guess what, im not crying about that either.

Its not what i want to call it, its what it is. Has the pace been slow, yeah in a way. Has it lit up the league, no. But you want to blame the DC for everything like a meatball. Im saying he's gotten results despite almost no help from anyone. Not from an Offense that has been a laughing stock for years. Not from the GM who consistently feeds him shit players.

2 high round defensive draft picks in 3 years, including none this year. A defensive FA class this year headed by Quintin fucking Demps, a guy who's specialty is lasting 1 year per team. WOW.

So again since you didn't answer me last time. Who exactly turns them into an elite turnover machine Defense under these circumstances? I've got one solitary name and even he brings no guarantees of better results. Who are you bringing in next year who's gonna be so much better?

So let me get this straight, you're assigning 50% of the blame for this trainwreck of a team on the Defense and specifically Fangio?? .......haaaaaaahahahahaha!

I'm pulling the plug on this "debate". Statements like your one above, just silly.

Sit tight till January, i still think you'll get your wish.

 

BTW, none of these posts should be taken as me being ok with last sunday, im not. But that whole team wasn't ready to play not just the Defense and that falls on the HC. Its a recurring theme when you look at Fox's history.

If they follow usual patterns they should be much better this week.

But if the Defense shits the bed against the POS Lions today then you may notice me shutting the F up about Fangio the good DC next week heh.

 

Neither am I, even though I think Loggains has held him back more than I like. Loggains sucks.

You damn well know I've assigned plenty of blame to Pace for the state of the team. I've also probably been Fox's strongest critic going back to 2015. Keep that in mind. Last week was a total team loss, everyone deserved blame but to me most disappointing was the effort of this defense. Yeah, the progress is still too slow. Yeah, we still see too many plays where they D looks out of position or caught off guard. We've been so bad for years that people like yourself are satisfied with being average. I'm not. As fans we should be realistic but we should also not hesitate to demand excellence. Fangio is far from the worst DC we've had. I'm just ready to move on. Period.

I never said I had anyone in mind for DC. I don't. That doesn't mean I have to be happy with the current guy. As far as HC goes I'd like to consider Josh McDaniels or even Harbaugh.

Umm no, never said that. But the D's progress has been too slow, the player development lacking, the lack of turnovers. The offense and Fox have lost more games for us than the D, no question. I've just seen enough to know I want change.

 

Its done blang, you're not interested in discussion or presenting plausible examples for your position. You just wanna be pissed off and fire the team, so go be pissed off. Good luck with the next DC.

 

I've specifically cited the lack of turnovers and lack of player development multiple times. You're not interested in hearing it. So be it.

Not that I'm looking forward to this, but I have reserved a spot for you on the Fire Fangio bandwagon. It'll be there when you're ready, when you need it.

 

You make some good points here, but gloss over a couple of things. Fangio has produced results with a defense that's gone from bad and undisciplined to average and sometimes making mistakes. He deserves credit for that. He deserves credit for getting Akeim Hicks to the next level--whereas he was considered an underachiever who was constantly lost in New Orleans, and that's part of the reason why the Saints let him walk at 26 years old.

However, Fangio has screwed up. Last week was a prime example. While I cant prove it would be 100% effective and realistically speaking the results likely wouldn't have happened--but he stopped blitzing a quarterback who didn't understand how it worked, and he panicked. He took his foot off the gas, and that's why Mike McCarthy beat the bears. It wasn't personnel, it was Mike McCarthy running mental circles around this entire staff.

Your point on the defense is spot on. I didn't care for Quentin Demps either; and if I recall correctly, you and I were two on the 'sign Micah Hyde' train.

How do you create more turnovers? Take your pick--get a secondary like the Seahawks, with 2-3 hall of famers and the 2nd CB who looks like a natural/Desean Shead's average play can be masked when Sherman, Chancellor, and Earl Thomas are playing back there with him. Now it goes without saying--you don't just get a secondary like this one that easily. You need luck and development and good coaching.

So what's the better alternative than getting 3 perennial all-pros?

Fix the pass rush. BWW pointed out Floyd drops into coverage enough, and when he does rush the QB, he's good, not elite. We've harped on McPhee's fat, undisciplined, one-kneed jackassery that sometimes can make a result. Acho fills a spot on the roster so well you don't even notice when he's on the field. And sometimes going-on-32 years old and a pectoral injury Willie Young; a guy I don't feel so hot about returning to form we expect/want. In addition, you've trotted out Mitch Unrein, another "placeholder" on your starting DLine.

Want more turnovers? Invest in another 5 tech and at least one starter at edge, preferably one that's not another Viper--or the coverage/weakside/finesse edge that Floyd seems to be taking point on.

There needs to be better depth and personnel. The bears just aren't there yet, and no offense to Fangio, he gets a little blame, but he's not a long term candidate for the future when this team does decide to start winning football games.

 

Plenty of players have developed, you just want your pound of flesh that's all. I've given you a list of examples and stats as long as my arm for why this defense operates the way it does and why it has gotten better, all you can provide is a cherry picked game from 2016 and vague references to blowing it in 2015. Its really weak, and seriously, anyone besides you and a few others on here would be receiving outright mockery for the sillyness you've shown in this thread.

That day may come. But if/when it does it won't be for the meatball motivations you've shown here.

 

I've acknowledged that they've gotten better from the Tucker days. It doesn't mean I'm satisfied with their progress. There's another side to this discussion and you're not willing to even fathom the possibility. And apparently that makes me a meatball. The examples I've shown you simply dismiss cuz they're not in 2017 or because Fangio gets a pass because of how badly Pace has done and the legacy of the Tucker years. Many games have been cited from all 3 years but whatever. I'm not trying to convince you of anything but the name calling is beneath you. We can have a disagreement. And maybe I'm wrong. Seriously hope so.

 

Nor should you be, but blaming the coach when it appears execution seems to be the culprit. I saw three balls in the hands DB's that could of been the difference in the game today. Kyle Fuller looks like an all pro one game and pedestrian the next. How many different signal callers have the Bears had the last two years? You may think Fangio is the problem rather than the solution, but I just don't agree with that line of thinking, because it appears it's all on execution within his defense that's at fault.