Where Do We Go From Here?

Discussion in 'Cleveland Browns' started by TopDawg, Oct 2, 2017.

  1. Your trying to tell me the Browns have the 9th best Def in the NFL lol
     
  2. TopDawg Legend

    Remember the day Hue couldn't even find his flag?
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    probably too bad he did.
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2017
  3. TopDawg Legend

    WHERE DO WE GO FROM HERE?

    I'm gonna go out on a limb and say 0-16....Then everyone gets fired, and we reset for the 10000th time...

    There's NO WAY they can trust Sashi with "final say" on another draft....And how could they possibly stagger into year three under Hue Jackson, when his record will be 1-31??? They simply can't...

    I'm actually having a difficult time deciding who has been worse at their jobs: The team on the field, or the front office that put this stupid plan together?

    All I can say is: As fans, WE MUST DEMAND BETTER!!!!

    This organization couldn't even change their shade of orange without making themselves look like idiots...Every fucking thing they do is a comedy of errors. Every decision they make, blows up in their faces like a Tom and Jerry cartoon...It's unbelievable.

    I'm done defending this clueless franchise...
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    Last edited: Nov 1, 2017
  4. LAOJoe Assistant Coach Manager Patreon Silver Maple Leafs Eagles

    If they still trust Sasha but only just a little bit to see the process 1a bit longer then they'll likely give him 1 more year but keep Hue so that they can make a big change next year.
     
  5. SAS M.V.P. Rams Chargers

    Where Do We Go From Here

    So The Plan has failed. Mostly. But here's the deal - what have the Browns done that is super analytic? Value draft picks over players? Nope... Jimmy Johnson pioneered that. Shed costly veterans on a bad team to save cap space? Nope... paging Joe Banner. Value players based on non-traditional metrics (adjusted air yards, SPARQ, DOYA, etc.)? Wrong again... many NFL teams have been doing this for years. So where's the break down?

    1. Jimmy Haslam as Team President
    The first failure is the current organization structure. Jimmy Haslam should not have multiple direct reports. He shouldn't be overly involved in making key football decisions (McCarron, Manziel). He should be the pockets and the guy who gets to smile biggest when holding up the Lombardi trophy.

    2. Hue Jackson

    Easily the biggest failure of the entire group. Point his decision not to hire an offensive coordinator, sure. What about this constantly flopping on quarterbacks? The quick hook he has on "his guys" (Kessler, Hogan, Kizer) and inability to identify quality QB talent. His in-game decision making, obviousness to the clock, a highly-penalized team, and a disconnect from his players/locker room are the main obstacles.

    So how do we fix it?

    Start with the org. structure. The Haslams need to hire a football guy to be the "President of Football Operations". The sort of go-between for the coaches, front office, and owner. A guy who knows football but doesn't want (or need) to put in the 60 hour work weeks just yet. Someone the Haslams' have a good relationship with and who wants to get into the business of football operations? Someone like...

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    ... this guy?

    Then, there's the "nerds" in the front office. Re-allocate Sashi Brown and Paul DePodesta. The analytics aren't the problem here... it's the analytic guys having the final say on roster decisions. Hiring Nick Caserio as the GM makes sense (and has been rumored). Sashi and DePodesta can keep working the analytics but a football guy who's got a killer resume and who was born and went to college in Ohio.

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    Obviously, Hue Jackson needs to be replaced. The pairing of Nick Caserio with Josh McDaniels (besdies again being rumored) makes a ton of sense. McDaniels is an offensive guy and could choose to leave a defensive vet like Gregg Williams in place, thereby allowing the progress made defensively to continue. He struggled as a head coach in Denver, but only after falling for the Tim Tebow hype (he started 6-0 as a rookie head coach and finished 8-8 his first season). We'd have to ask a Broncos expert who had the say over Tebow, but McDaniels and Caserio have worked together and would likely be on the same page regarding a quarterback.

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    The finally, there's nailing the draft. The Browns have an inordinate number of picks in 2018 (thanks completely to the analytics "nerds"). The obvious pick at No. 1 overall is Saquon Barkley, unless one of the prospective QB prospects elevates their game to the next level. They still have enough assets to get their guy without having to burn No. 1 overall and still come away with a Baker Mayfield or Lamar Jackson to plug into the team.

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  6. kenibals Home Town Favorite Browns

    Nice breakdown SAS. I'm with you most of the way, but I'm still in the camp of commitment.

    I want Hue to stay, god help me. Not cause I think he's done anything to earn it, but I do believe he's made enough mistakes that he can learn from it. Haslam or whoever he hires to head up Football Ops, has to lay down the law: Hire a good strong OC, and let him do his job. Then do yours Hue. You are the Top Guy, and have to devote your energies to your staff, and to good communications with the FO.

    Mostly, I believe that the continuation of the O and D approaches in general, will pay dividends. The talent has been improved and will likely be improved yet again with the upcoming draft, so I'm for allowing the organizational team to pull it together. They've had 2 years to stumble and fall, but I am sure they also are self aware enough to know what they've done wrong. I hope (I'm a Browns fan after all) that they take those lessons and accept the blame, and dedicate themselves to one another anew, and pull together with humility and courage to see they are truly "on this together", and have to rely on each other, and support each other, become a true team.

    Like I said, I "hope" they get the oppty to show they have learned and have grown. The Team needs them to be united in purpose and direction. That is what we've been missing, along with a QB, that is.
     
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  7. TopDawg Legend

    Unless they somehow lure Kirk Cousins or some other veteran to the Land, the Browns will be selecting a QB with their first pick. I'm confident you can chalk that one up. In fact, go ahead and use a Sharpie...I can't imagine a scenario where they pass early on QB again. The factory might burn down. There could be anarchy in the streets..
     
    Last edited: Nov 2, 2017
  8. TopDawg Legend

    My guess is Rosen or Allen...
     
  9. demolisher43 Franchise Player Steelers

    Mason Rudolph is gaining traction among pundits as a popular pick to go first overall. I don't know about that, but I did feel he was underrated coming into the season. I haven't seen Allen near the top of a big board in what feels like months. Meanwhile, Sam Darnold is really falling from grace.
     
  10. IrishDawg42 Legend Manager Browns Buckeyes Fighting Irish

    The funny part is, I have seen "headlines" from the talking heads stating that if the Browns have the #1 overall pick, Darnold may stay at USC for another year rather than go to the Browns..

    I have another NEWS FLASH for Sam Darnold...You would NOT be the #1 overall pick...so if your intent is to not go to the Browns, this would be the perfect time for you to enter the draft...

    #borderlinesecondrounder
     
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  11. SAS M.V.P. Rams Chargers

    It speaks volumes about Darnold's lack of intelligence and lack of appreciation for his opportunity. It also displays a level of narcissism the league hasn't seen since Eli Manning refused to play for San Diego. There are dozens of scenarios in which with or without the first overall pick, the Browns could take this fringe third-rounder. The Browns cynic in me could also say if he stays to 2019, the Browns still might have the top pick.

    Put simply: F**k Sam Darnold.
     
    TopDawg likes this.
  12. Lyman "Franchise Asshole" Browns Buckeyes

    This reminds me more of John Elway threatening to play baseball rather than be drafted by the Baltimore Colts.
     
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  13. TopDawg Legend

    Or when Eli told the Chargers, "don't pick me. I don't wanna play for your organization."....Or was it Archie doing all the talking? Either way, had to be a bit uncomfortable for San Diego...Though they did select him anyway, before quickly trading to the Giants for Rivers...I always thought the Mannings came off looking very snobbish on that one, but when your dad is Arch, and your brother is Peyton, you get your way I guess...
     
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  14. Lyman "Franchise Asshole" Browns Buckeyes

    This may not be a very popular opinion in here but . . .

    I'm not sold on S. Barkley being selected at #1 overall. Granted, Ohio State has a very good defense but it IS NOT an NFL caliber defense. Take away Barkley's opening kickoff return for a TD (defensed by special teamers, read: backups) and one TD run from scrimage, and he looked very pedestrian.
     
  15. IrishDawg42 Legend Manager Browns Buckeyes Fighting Irish

    The resounding question will be, who do you replace him with and do they have 12 games a season where they look like an absolute stud?
     
  16. IrishDawg42 Legend Manager Browns Buckeyes Fighting Irish

    So do you want Josh Rosen, my own personal #1 QB in the 2018 draft, who is currently injured and if you want a game red flag, look at the Arizona game (you think OSU isn't a NFL caliber defense? Arizona isn't in the same atmosphere as OSU, ranked #90 overall, 124 out of 130 against the pass) Rosen was 20 of 34 for 219 yards, 0 TDs and 3 INTs.

    Does that disqualify him as a #1 overall candidate?

    Our pal Sam Darnold against Washington State was 15 of 29 for 164 yards 0 TDs and 1 INT in their loss to the Cougars


    The point is, you can take any player in the NCAA and even if they are being talked about as a top 5 pick, you will find games with flaws.
     
  17. Lyman "Franchise Asshole" Browns Buckeyes

    That's kind of my point. Recognizing this was a 1 game sample, he didn't look the part of a stud to me. Quite the opposite. He has tremendous stats for the season but, so far, he racked those stats up against defenses that were not as good as OSU's and OSU does not have an NFL caliber defense.

    I just think a little due diligence is required before taking a RB (any RB) at #1 overall, especially considering some of the other many glaring weaknesses on our offense.

    Namely, WR, LT, LB and, yes, QB.
     
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  18. IrishDawg42 Legend Manager Browns Buckeyes Fighting Irish

    If you are going to go off of this type of rule, then you better get on Train Engineer SAS' Baker Mayfield train. He is probably one of the most efficient players in the NCAA without looking up his stats...He is the one that immediately comes to mind.
     
    SAS likes this.
  19. TopDawg Legend

    Just my opinion, but I think Barkley is a little over-rated...People talk about him like he's the next "great one", but I have concerns, especially with the notion that Cleveland should go ALL IN on him at #1...
     
    Lyman likes this.
  20. TopDawg Legend

    Amen.
     

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