Can Big Ben get his game back?

Discussion in 'Pittsburgh Steelers' started by jcmac7272, Nov 13, 2017.

  1. beachbum M.V.P. Steelers

    p.s. Here's the view from the pocket. Ben is clearly trying to influence the safety but he isn't fooled. He moves just outside the hash mark.

    [​IMG]
     
  2. beachbum M.V.P. Steelers

    Safety not committing either way...

    [​IMG]
     
  3. blackngoldbad Franchise Player Steelers

    Not just that Beach, because AB gets a release off the line to the outside there isn't enough room for the single high safety deep to rotate over, even if Ben just continues to stare down AB and throw the ball his way. And because he has a step and a half on the outside, Ben has an easier throw and is able to use the sideline to his benefit. He can put the ball where AB makes a play or nobody does. He can throw it with more pace because the corner is NOT going to be able to get his head turned around to play the ball or he risks giving AB even more separation. This is a classic example of an elite player getting all the separation and space he needs to make a play with no help along the sidelines or deep.............so why not throw it to him? Whether its back shoulder, a go route or 20 yard dig..........AB has already won on the play.
     
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  4. ajmtanas Franchise Player Steelers

    Thursday night’s game will be mostly broadcasted from the “skycam” therefore we may get a chance to see first hand how Benny Boy’s shenanigans and theatrics continue to miss open receivers.
     
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  5. gidion72 M.V.P. Steelers

    He would have thrown it to AB but he wasn't triple covered.
     
  6. MaineofSteel Home Town Favorite Steelers

    they may be there catching on beach ... although it's Ben who has to catch on to fix .... this article begins with the same play you demonstrated for us and continues on to a few others ... one of which is the shovel "pass" to James... in the real time experience of the game it just looked like (to me) James was surprised by the shovel... Ben missed him by 2 full yards and I think was throwing it to where he wanted (thought) James would be ... don't think you can have that expectation on such a bang bang improve play. Author of the article blames both QB and bad receivers but squarely lays the blame for our anemic offense on passing element of offense. Look at all the missed opportunities !!!! Haley et al have to be seeing this in film room ...

    http://www.steelersdepot.com/2017/11/film-room-offense-filled-missed-opportunities/

    I know it's too late, I know our only hope for #7 lays in the hands of Ben but I so wish Dobbs (agree w/Mano & beach.... he does have all the tools except OTJ experience) was magically available to us because I don't think Ben is playing like he used (obviously?) to and has lost the map to the promised land...

    ps aj, nice post ... really hope you're right
    Thursday night’s game will be mostly broadcasted from the “skycam” therefore we may get a chance to see first hand how Benny Boy’s shenanigans and theatrics continue to miss open receivers.
     
  7. showstopper Franchise Player Browns

    I think the blame is solely on Bryant here....the DB is playing outside leverage w a big cushion..if he runs a skinny post he has a better chance for a completion...instead he runs outside of the DB and Ben throws it inside for the easy pick....there is no way Ben is completing this pass by dropping it in the bucket w the technique of the DB
     
  8. blackngoldbad Franchise Player Steelers

    The receiver can only adjust to the ball thrown once he locates it and tracks it. The pattern called is the pattern initially run, which was a go route. The blame primarily goes on the QB opting to throw the ball in the first place to:

    1) The FAR side of the field from the opposite hash..........therefore making it an even LONGER and more difficult throw.
    2) Deciding to throw it when you damn well know you don't have the arm strength to make that throw........at least not with a high arching throw to the inside of the receiver where the DB is tracking the throw the entire way.
    3) At a DB playing 10+ yards off his man with his eyes locked on Ben as he backpedals, allowing him to easily anticipate the general vicinity of the throw nearly the entire way.
    4) any other receiver on the play when his All-Pro receiver, the only living ninja on the planet right now that cannot be pressed off the line of scrimmage by almost anybody, has gotten a clean release from the jump and has a step+ on his man in true man coverage with no help available over the top by the safety on the play.............with AB on the SHORT side of the field, allowing for an even easier throw.

    You could argue MB perhaps needed to become more of a defender on the throw once he knows it isn't getting there, and try to play keep away, but the DECISION to throw to him in the first place is the bigger problem here. Bryant can run by almost anybody and set up the potential for a home run ball. But its got to be in straight man without a soft cushion, or has to come off a double move to shake a deep safety over the top - which takes time to run and good protection. Teams are playing a lot of deep safety, or high-lowing against Pitt defensively on the outside to try and eliminate or reduce the possibility for the home run ball as we have TWO guys that can take it all the way on any one play. As a result, there is a LOT of room in the middle of the field and underneath that Ben needs to start exploiting more or taking it when its there, to bring safeties up closer to the box, or force LBs to drop back further and into coverage more often. Doing so will open up more opportunities on the outside for AB/MB/J2S2, or more space for Bell at the second level on running plays. A good all around TE (especially one that's healthy) would do wonders here, as would a reliable/confident Eli Rogers. JuJu is money, but is used everywhere, not just in the slot or middle area of the field.
     
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  9. firehalo Legend Penguins Steelers

    At no point during that play did Bryant have a step on the DB. The only way the ball could've been caught by the WR, Big Dumb would've had to put the ball on the outside, nearer the sideline. I can see being aggressive after noticing at a 1 on 1, but he didn't have the arm to hit MB in stride. Didn't have the juice to get it to the sideline. Ben just hasn't realized his decline yet. He had much better options on the field too. Bell/McD/AB. Poor decision. Poor execution.
     
  10. showstopper Franchise Player Browns

    He had no chance to throw it to the sidelines...the DB would have squeezed Bryant and there is no way he gets his feet in bounds...the throw was a skinny post on a line about 20-25 yds on the hash cause the DB was playing outside and Bryant would have had inside leverage
     
  11. showstopper Franchise Player Browns

    The safety was shading toward AB so I think the correct read was working the other side of the field...it should have been the middle right behind LB depth or Bryant on a skinny post
     
  12. blackngoldbad Franchise Player Steelers

    Scroll up to Beach's gif. The safety never committed to either side, in THIS CASE, Ben could have continue to throw down AB and actually made the throw and the safety never would have had time to get there to make a play as it was the short side of the field, and the throw (hopefully) would have been to the outside. Now if Ben throws a lollipop or wounded duck..........THEN the safety maybe has a chance. But in this case, he didn't really need to look off the safety for either side of the field because he was non-committal on the play.
     
  13. demolisher43 Franchise Player Steelers

    Is no one going to talk about how Bell was wide freaking open underneath everything on a delayed route for an easy first down?
     
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  14. firehalo Legend Penguins Steelers

    I mentioned it, in combo to the other options. You're right. Wide open at 30... on the numbers.
     
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  15. MaineofSteel Home Town Favorite Steelers

    demo;
    Is no one going to talk about how Bell was wide freaking open underneath everything on a delayed route for an easy first down?


    MoS:
    Not sure who the receiver is on the 30 yard line ... all alone for easy first down but there isn't even a defender in his area for 8-10 yards ... Ben never looked to his left, didn't survey half the field and once made up his mind where he was throwing ... that's all he wrote ... again ...


    firehalo;
    I mentioned it, in combo to the other options. You're right. Wide open at 30... on the numbers.

    So what's the deal here? I the three of us, beach and other see this, why isn't Ben? ... because he makes his mind up B4 ever even throwing? Because he doesn't look the field over B4 passing? Whatever it is it's game changing in the wrong direction and better teams will provide poorer results for our offense, or should I say we'll provide poorer results for our own initiatives.
     
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  16. blackngoldbad Franchise Player Steelers

    Nah, LB is squatting in general area. Although he appears to be 5 yards off of Bell, if Ben turns his way, winds up and throws to him, the LB is able to break on the ball and probably wrap him up as he's catching the ball for minimal gain.
     
  17. firehalo Legend Penguins Steelers

    Disagree. Not looking for a home run, just a first down. The LB "shadowing" Bell was at least 7 yards off and back-pedaling. Bell v (1) LB with at minimum 3 yd cushion (the back-pedaling LB will make a play, but he needs to get there first), I like that match-up. I like it a lot better than the 2nd down "punt" Big Dumb threw.
     
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  18. gidion72 M.V.P. Steelers

    Ben needs to go all west coast and stop the street ball.
     
  19. MaineofSteel Home Town Favorite Steelers

    b&g;
    Nah, LB is squatting in general area. Although he appears to be 5 yards off of Bell, if Ben turns his way, winds up and throws to him, the LB is able to break on the ball and probably wrap him up as he's catching the ball for minimal gain.


    can't exactly disagree with this b&g, but i think halo is right... i'll take the dime to Bell when he's 3 yards past LOS, still 3-4 yards distance between breaking LB...
    (although dang, weren't there a lot of Bell shoestring tackles this game?) ... next nearest LB is 10 yards (on hash) and is relegated to angle and safety is on same hash but another 15-18 yards down field with a less severe angle but still one on one tackling with a greatly elusive back. I'll take the safe first down to maybe big gainer with safer pass (really didn't NEED a big play on 2nd snap of game)... shorter, safer pass with near 100% completion in the hands of the best RB in the league .... oooooor ... "sure hope MB can break that up if I miss !"

    heck. I like the 12 yard pass to McDonald right in between the hashes more than the MB under throw. Ben can get the ball to Vance a lot easier and more safely with another 1st down to extend drive. No, it's not the home run ... it's just; take what they give you, smart football.

    I really would opt for staying on the field, wearing down the defense, extending down and distance offense on a potentially demoralizing first set of downs.
     
  20. MaineofSteel Home Town Favorite Steelers

    showstopper;
    the throw was a skinny post on a line about 20-25 yds on the hash cause the DB was playing outside and Bryant would have had inside leverage


    from your mouth to Haley's ears ... ! This would have been a great call since DB was so far off MB. Make em pay for the distance given...
     

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