166

Re: 2017 NFL Draft Grades and Discussion

Tim were those last teams your 1-2-3?

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167

Re: 2017 NFL Draft Grades and Discussion

LAOJoe wrote:

Tim were those last teams your 1-2-3?

No but I know for sure that one is in the top 10. I'm not at home right now so I will have to double check.

"Kid, I wouldn't last five minutes leading an outfit like that if I wasn't as rotten as hell."

168 ( edited by TopDawg 05-20-17 08:45)

Re: 2017 NFL Draft Grades and Discussion

My top 3 "draft winners" are Cleveland, New Orleans, and New England....All three had excellent offseasons, and I will be curious to see where the most impact is made.  I  got the champs, a mediocre (at best) Saints team, and the cellar dwellar in Cleveland... Among my favorite value picks for each team: Cleveland - Mathew Dayes....Saints - Alvin Kamara......Pats - Derek Rivers(pictured).......
http://sportshub.cbsistatic.com/i/r/2017/03/16/dd0bb124-8449-4ec1-bbbf-1c2e42c6bac7/thumbnail/770x433/05e5921d45fdc7301ef7c4dd176608ad/derek-rivers.jpg
As far as the mock draft world is concerned, I think I still have to go back to mock #1....These three still stand out IMO....(I didn't feel like searching for Lyman's entire draft, but this one gets the nod for obvious reasons);
BROWNS
1.1  MYLES GARRETT
1.12  JABRIL PEPPERS
2.1  DAVID NJOKU

http://sportshub.cbsistatic.com/i/r/2017/04/29/ee26e310-2f19-432e-bdd0-0cd2ea919599/thumbnail/770x433/22453fdc40dbc3167c510fc69cc5c2c0/2017-nfl-draft-winners-and-losers-browns-bears-panthers-saints.jpg
lol! and that's how it's done...


SAINTS
1.11  JAMAL ADAMS
2.10 GAREON CONLEY
3.12 JOE MIXON
4.11 ARDARIUS STEWART
5.17  JOSH DOBBS
7.11  TARIK COHEN(pictured)
http://image.cdnllnwnl.xosnetwork.com/pics33/800/KH/KHCRTESOPGCMAWF.20140914030120.jpg

BUCS
1.19 JOHN ROSS
2.18  EVAN ENGRAM
3.20 CHIDOBE AWUZIE
4.19  DUWUANE SMOOT
4.35  WAYNE GALLMAN
7.1    KYLE KALIS
7.19  RAYSHAWN JENKINS (pictured)
https://cmgpbpcaneswatch.files.wordpress.com/2015/07/rayshawn-jenkins-1000.jpg

let it ride

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Thank you!: LAOJoe

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169

Re: 2017 NFL Draft Grades and Discussion

I don't know if I'd call using a 2nd and 7th on Kamara necessarily a value pick.

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170

Re: 2017 NFL Draft Grades and Discussion

Fair enough....I still like the pick though. I believe,  Kamara will be the back in that New Orleans stable that has the most fantasy impact, as well.

let it ride

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171 ( edited by LAOJoe 05-20-17 11:37)

Re: 2017 NFL Draft Grades and Discussion

I like Kamara but it's a tough committee to give carries to.  Ingram and AP are there.

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172

Re: 2017 NFL Draft Grades and Discussion

LAOJoe wrote:

I like Kamara but it's a tough committee to give carries to.  Ingram and AP are there.

He won't get the most carries...Brees will effectively use Kamara in the passing game.  No doubt though, with three horses like that in the fold, they will eat into each other's fantasy stats.

let it ride

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173

Re: 2017 NFL Draft Grades and Discussion

Injury's are a bigger and bigger part of the game. Cant have too much depth.

.............................................................................................  Lost my mind........................... I don't mind...

174 ( edited by LAOJoe 05-21-17 12:16)

Re: 2017 NFL Draft Grades and Discussion

Miami Dolphins

Round 1, Pick 22 (22)    
DE - Charles Harris, Missouri / A

The Dolphins have a very peculiar rotation at DE. Cameron Wake is their pass rushing specialist and he only sees about the field half the time. You will likely see Andre Branch out the most and William Hayes and Harris will be able to see plenty of meaningful playing time in this rotation. Wake and Hayes are over 30 and there is no real youth on this team. Miami gets a solid player they need now and later. Also don't be surprised in they draft another early in the next couple years.

Round 2, Pick 22 (54)
LB - Raekwon McMillan, Ohio State / A

McMillan probably wont be a starter on day one but hey could be by the time the season is over, whether by injury or on his own merit. Timmons was brought in to start on the inside and I would think Koa Misi has first crack in keeping his job on the strong side since he has played well when healthy. Alonso should move to WILL. Misi and Timmons are over 30 and the depth is poor so the Dolphins desperately needed to add another potential starter early before it became a real problem.

Round 3, Pick 33 (97)
CB - Cordrea Tankersley, Clemson / C

Tankersley is not one of my preferred CBs in the draft. I even had a nightmare about my team trading up for him in the 2nd. That being said, the back end of the 3rd is a fine time for him to go, especially when a bunch of other CBs are off the board. I don't see him finding starting time anytime soon unless they put him in the slot but that would be where he is most vulnerable.

Round 5, Pick 20 (164)
OG - Isaac Asiata, Utah / A

Asiata probably isn't ready to start right away but he has a solid skill set that should be ready to contribute heavily in a couple of years. If he was more pro ready he probably would have went much earlier. The Dolphins need some depth and they get an excellent prospect that can fill in at times early on.

Round 5, Pick 35 (178)
DT - Davon Godchaux, LSU / B

I find this pick to be good value. I don't think he should have gone on the 2nd day or anything but the end of the 5th round is a great time to get him. Considering the team depth he may be the first player in this class to become a starter, although I don't think he should be rushed. The DT position next to Suh is wide open.

Round 6, Pick 10 (194)
DT - Vincent Taylor, Oklahoma State / B

As with Godchaux, Taylor will get a chance to earn that starter spot but, even more so than Davon, Vincent isn't ready. The team needs depth though and I would be shocked if he doesn't make the roster.

Round 7, Pick 19 (237)
WR - Isaiah Ford, Virginia Tech / A

I had a higher grade on Ford. I didn't have him in the same breath as players expected to go in rounds 2 and 3. This may sound a bit confusing but he has a high potential to be an average NFL WR. That is good. He has a low floor and his ceiling probably isn't too high but all you want is a solid contributor and I believe Ford can be just that and be along for the NFL ride for a few contracts.


FINAL GRADE: A

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175

Re: 2017 NFL Draft Grades and Discussion

Minnesota Vikings

Round 2, Pick 9 (41)
RB - Dalvin Cook, Florida State / A

That is a solid fit and decent value even if you are unsure of his pro prospects. I don't know if Cook will be able to translate his college success into the NFL but he is placed in a good situation where he could immediately become the feature back with solid support or be a key piece in a committee with Murray and McKinnon. A team in need of a running back taking Cook in the 2nd is a solid A grade.

Round 3, Pick 6 (70)
C- Pat Elflein, Ohio State / A

The Vikings drafted an immediate starter at center and possibly the best one in the draft. They were in dire need of a starter at C or RG along with some depth and Elflein should start with Joe Berger moving to right guard.

Round 4, Pick 2 (109)
DT - Jaleel Johnson, Iowa / C

I think Johnson can play DT in a 4-3 but not both DT positions are necessarily equal. Linval Joseph should be entrenched as a starter and that is the position where Johnson likely fits best in the Vikings' scheme. It's a solid rotational pick and they could have gone with someone else but most of the quality options available likely will a similar role as Johnson.

Round 4, Pick 14 (120)
ILB - Ben Gedeon, Michigan / B

I really like Ben Gedeon. He is a workhorse with an eye for the ball carrier that has shown success on the field. His major knock is his one year of starting experience and unlike other more celebrated positions like QB, RB and edge rusher, most position players normally don't get drafted until late, especially when they show a lack of refinement as Ben does. That being said, it also shows immense potential to improve and the Vikings made sure to get him and I don't think they necessarily reached doing so.

Round 5, Pick 27 (170)
WR - Rodney Adams, South Florida / C

The Vikings have 3 promising WRs at the top of their depth chart with Treadwell, Thielen and Diggs but they have very little of anything behind them. Unfortunately for the Vikings, outside of a few personal preferences remaining, the WR board was pretty bare. They probably should have taken one in the 4th. Adams will likely be expected to come in a few times a game and will spend the next couple of seasons developing and hopefully become a steady presence in this offense.

Round 5, Pick 37 (180)
OG - Danny Isidora, Miami / C

Danny Isidora is solid at the 2nd level but is very inconsistent in other facets. He is likely just strictly a zone blocker but the Vikings primarily run a zone scheme so that helps. He does well vs power rushers but will struggle vs athletic defenders. He has short arms and needs to improve on his footwork. He will make the team as guard depth and will have to spend a few years developing before he can make a serious run at a larger role.

Round 6, Pick 17 (201)
TE - Bucky Hodges, Virginia Tech / A

If Adam Shaheen is baby Gronk then Hodges is Baby Graham. Both are likely lofty and overblown expectations but it's a flattering comparison. Hodges will rarely be asked to be an in-line blocker and isn't that good in any type of blocking. He is a pure receiving tight end. But there is nothing against that. He is a fantastic receiver. He will be a tight end in name only and be more of a slot receiver that can handle some TE duties. Just like Jimmy Graham. This is excellent value.

Round 7, Pick 1 (219)
WR - Stacy Coley, Miami / F

I don't believe that Coley can beat a true NFL corner to get open. He may have to play in the slot exclusively and that is a tough sell when you aren't proficient at the position. He also apparently doesn't like the game, which is a tough sell when you aren't a more skilled player. He may stick around for a season for depth but I don't think he makes it near the end of his rookie deal.

Round 7, Pick 2 (220)
DE - Ifeadi Odenigbo, Northwestern / D

Odenigbo has a ways to go before being pro ready. He could theoretically line up anywhere on the defensive line but he is a jack of all trades and master of none. Ideally he would improve as a run blocker and develop inside but I feel the Vikings will try to use him as a situational pass rusher on the edge if at all. If he doesn't make the roster he should definitely make the practice roster but he'll need a lot of coaching.

Round 7, Pick 14 (232)
LB - Elijah Lee, Kansas State / B

Lee has starter potential. He also has the potential to never see the field in his career. He won't be ready right away. He needs to improve his tackling and pass coverage. He also bites a bit too often on the ball carrier's first move. That being said his play against the run is well above average and when he see the play he seems to always find himself to the ball carrier. He'll likely have to work his way up from special teamer and situational defender before he gets to start but he has the potential.

Round 7, Pick 27 (245)
SS - Jack Tocho, N.C. State / D

Tocho has skills in coverage but there is concern that he won't be able to keep up with NFL WRs and get beat over top. His best bet will be to move to strong safety but it may be difficult for him to crack the roster.


FINAL GRADE: B

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Thank you!: Tim, Will

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176

Re: 2017 NFL Draft Grades and Discussion

I had these two ready before then stuff happened. I'll try to get the rest out soon.

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177

Re: 2017 NFL Draft Grades and Discussion

Tim wrote:

Pittsburgh Steelers

Round 1, Pick 30 (30)    
LB - T.J. Watt, Wisconsin / A

This is an interesting pick for Pittsburgh as Watt projects to either OLB or ILB in a 3-4 set. He has the ability to step into either role and contribute immediately but the Steelers are obviously in search of answers on the outside and T.J. will need to develop his game more to be a consistent force on the edge. This is a good upside pick to fill one of 2 positions of need at linebacker.

There are number of guys I probably would have liked better here that were more polished but by the same token it's pretty amazing how far along the guy is from a technique standpoint considering he's only been playing defense for two seasons. Clearly he can take coaching and he has a non-stop motor like his brother.

I imagine he is spending a decent amount of time emulating his brother's workout routine as well so it's fun to think about how good this kid could be someday. I never considered him an inside backer but it makes some sense if you then kick him outside in obvious passing situations. The Steelers will probably be using more 3-safety looks going forward as it is.

Tim wrote:

Round 2, Pick 30 (62)    
WR - JuJu Smith-Schuster, U.S.C. / B+

I'm not has high on Smith-Schuster as some, but for Pittsburgh this is a solid pick at the end of round 2. It creates some insurance for the Steelers if they choose to move on from Martavis Bryant at the end of his rookie deal, or if Bryant chooses to violate the league's substance abuse policy again.

This pick says pretty clearly they won't consider extending Martavis which is really sad because he is so freakin' dynamic and adds so much to the team. At least we have him two more seasons.

Tim wrote:

Round 3, Pick 30 (94)    
CB - Cameron Sutton, Tennessee / C+

Sutton is a bit of a reach at this point in the draft. He likely has a professional role as a slot corner but there will be times that he will have to remain off the field in that role, specifically against slot players with strong athletic traits as Sutton is a sub-par athlete for the position.

Cam battled an ankle injury last year. Look at his 2015 film and you see a lot more athleticism. I really liked this pick when I took him in our mock and only passed on him in the official mock because I already doubled up on Henderson and didn't want to do the same on Sutton. Wanted some variety. Kid is wicked smart.

Tim wrote:

Round 3, Pick 41 (105)
RB - James Conner, Pittsburgh / A+

One of my favorite players in the draft, James Conner is a good pick for Pittsburgh as it provides a quality back-up with starters potential at a position that needs an upgrade considering the health, suspension and contract concerns for Le'Veon Bell. Sure to be a coaches favorite, you can expect Conner to earn his way into some quality reps before the end of his rookie season.

This is another example of a kid not playing at 100% in 2016. Prior to the MCL tear and cancer diagnosis some scouts thought he was a late 1st / early 2nd round pick. May also be a sign that the early talks aren't going well with Bell and the team. I didn't franchise Bell in our exercise because I don't believe you can franchise a guy at 12M and then ask him sign a contract with an annual average below 12M and I think that's what the Steelers are trying to do. I don't think they will be successful. Conner gives them a young back to move forward with in 2018 if it doesn't work out.

Tim wrote:

Round 4, Pick 29 (135)    
QB - Joshua Dobbs, Tennessee / B-

Dobbs may not be a huge upgrade over Landry Jones, but it's a good move on Pittsburgh's part to try and locate a transitional quarterback in the middle stages of the draft with rumors of Ben Roethlisberger considering retirement. This is not the long term answer or franchise replacement at the position but it could provide a life preserver until that player is identified in a future draft.

Can't remember the thread (might not have even been this site) but I said back in January if you could get Joshua Dobbs in the 4th round you pull the trigger. Unlike some, I think this kid has a future as a starting NFL QB but he needs to sit for a couple of years and learn.

Tim wrote:

Round 5, Pick 30 (173)
CB - Brian Allen, Utah / B+

This is a solid pick at the bottom of round 5 as Allen has the necessary physical traits to become a starter on the outside at cornerback. There will be a learning curve to overcome, but the idea of having Artie Burns and Brian Allen as a future starting duo for the Steelers is a very intriguing one.

Honestly don't know much about him but he had a nice rookie minicamp.

Tim wrote:

Round 6, Pick 30 (213)
LS - Colin Holba, Louisville / D+

I understand wanting to have a good long snapper on the roster, but Pittsburgh has other needs that should have been addressed here. I don't have a problem with the player, just the pick of his position at this spot.

I understand the criticism but I also thought Colbert did a good job explaining the decision making...

Colbert wrote:

"In college football, most long snappers are walk-ons. And because of their rules – there are different rules as to how you can defend them or block them after the snap – they have a lot more liberties than we do in the NFL," Colbert said. "So a lot of the college snappers are these 6-1, 215-220-pound guys, which really would have a hard time snapping and blocking in our league."

"It's no secret, Greg is moving into what I believe will be Year 13," Colbert said. "You have to be able to back that up."

"Not many long snappers come along that we believe are draftable," Colbert said. "New England took a kid a few years back who is their starting long snapper. And when we see one, we want to add him in the mix, just like we would any other position."

Tim wrote:

Round 7, Pick 30 (248)
OLB - Keion Adams, Western Michigan B+

For a developmental edge rusher this is a pick with some upside. Adams fits with what the Steelers ask of the outside linebackers and there is likely a long career for Keion in Pittsburgh.

Practice Squad

I would agree with you but then we would both be wrong!

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Thank you!: Tim

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