3,916

Re: Detroit Red Wings

Red Wings lines vs Avalanche
Nyquist-Zetterberg-Tatar
Mantha-Nielsen-Helm
Athanasiou-Larkin-Abdelkader
Miller-Sheahan-Glendening
Nosek extra

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Re: Detroit Red Wings

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Re: Detroit Red Wings

Cant believe 'the streak' gets brought up still by so called professional broadcasters .

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Re: Detroit Red Wings

So I'm trying to chart the wings rebuild.

Too early for most prospects, but I'm going to say that I don't see a franchise player in the group right now.    Plenty of good young players, but I don't see first line talent (as in first line player for a perennial playoff team)  in the next 2 or 3 years.

Lots of bad money to get off the books.
Zetterberg is tolerable, but he has 4 years left
Nielsen has 5 years left but it is frontloaded,  he'll be easier to move or buyout in a few years
Darren "IR" Helm has 4 years left
Glendening has 4 years left
Mike Green has another year left
Howard has 2 years
Kronwall has 2
Ericsson has 3
Mule has 3
Weiss has 4 more years of dead money.

Fortunately, most of the deals take advantage of ownership's willingness to spend.   Most of the dollars are bigger at the front end of deals.    About half the league deals in real dollars rather than cap dollars, so these types of contract structures make it easier to move players out of the way.

Unfortunately, they are going to have to burn time to unwind the bad contracts, they have 68 million committed to the cap already. 

I'm not sure where the starting point is, but I don't think they're going to be able to unwind anything quickly, even if they use all 3 of their salary retained transactions each of the next 3 years.

With a new arena, might not be the worst time to take a year to completely suck, the problem is it's looking like it's going to be 3 years at least...which usually means 5 to 7.     

They might be better off moving some of the young studs and unloading bad paper just to finish the turnaround a little quicker. 

Players like Nyquist, Tatar, Abdelkader, Dekeyser, and Teletubby should be moved quickly imo.   Better to start stocking up the system, clearing contract slots, and clearing bad money.    Those 5 players (and a few other prospects), help clear the table in all those areas.    Even Mrazek shouldn't be untouchable imo.   

It's going to be painful, but I think Detroit is better positioned than Buffalo, Toronto, Washington,STL or most of the others was when they started going into tank command mode.

"I'm not god, I'm not a doctor.  I'm closer to a veterinarian than a doctor"- Darryl Sutter

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3,924

Re: Detroit Red Wings

Zetterberg on pace to play 1,000th game in Joe Louis Arena farewell

Barring injury, Red Wings captain Henrik Zetterberg will get the opportunity to make his 1,000th NHL game even more special.
Detroit head coach Jeff Blashill confirmed today that Zetterberg will play tonight and tomorrow in Carolina, putting the 36-year-old on pace to play his 1,000th game on Apr. 9, the date of the final Wings game at Joe Louis Arena.

The Wings, who will miss the playoffs for the first time since 1990, have eight games left in their regular season. They host New Jersey on Apr. 9.

Tonight’s game was originally scheduled for Dec. 19, but had to be postponed due to poor ice conditions at PNC Arena.

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3,925

Re: Detroit Red Wings

hockeybob wrote:

So I'm trying to chart the wings rebuild.

Too early for most prospects, but I'm going to say that I don't see a franchise player in the group right now.    Plenty of good young players, but I don't see first line talent (as in first line player for a perennial playoff team)  in the next 2 or 3 years.

Lots of bad money to get off the books.
Zetterberg is tolerable, but he has 4 years left
Nielsen has 5 years left but it is frontloaded,  he'll be easier to move or buyout in a few years
Darren "IR" Helm has 4 years left
Glendening has 4 years left
Mike Green has another year left
Howard has 2 years
Kronwall has 2
Ericsson has 3
Mule has 3
Weiss has 4 more years of dead money.

Fortunately, most of the deals take advantage of ownership's willingness to spend.   Most of the dollars are bigger at the front end of deals.    About half the league deals in real dollars rather than cap dollars, so these types of contract structures make it easier to move players out of the way.

Unfortunately, they are going to have to burn time to unwind the bad contracts, they have 68 million committed to the cap already. 

I'm not sure where the starting point is, but I don't think they're going to be able to unwind anything quickly, even if they use all 3 of their salary retained transactions each of the next 3 years.

With a new arena, might not be the worst time to take a year to completely suck, the problem is it's looking like it's going to be 3 years at least...which usually means 5 to 7.     

They might be better off moving some of the young studs and unloading bad paper just to finish the turnaround a little quicker. 

Players like Nyquist, Tatar, Abdelkader, Dekeyser, and Teletubby should be moved quickly imo.   Better to start stocking up the system, clearing contract slots, and clearing bad money.    Those 5 players (and a few other prospects), help clear the table in all those areas.    Even Mrazek shouldn't be untouchable imo.   

It's going to be painful, but I think Detroit is better positioned than Buffalo, Toronto, Washington,STL or most of the others was when they started going into tank command mode.

I was wondering what you think of AA and Larkin as 1st line material. I have a suspicion that that's the direction the Wings are going to go, which means rebuild time for the next few years, even tho they wont admit to it.

I wonder if larkin can shake of the sophomore jinx and get it going. I don't like the way he's been handled... is he a winger or a center? I think maybe he should be on the wing and have less to deal with on the defense and transition game as a center. He would have less to think abot and maybe be just a scorer. He might just need more time to ripen too.

AA looks awesome, hope he continues to improve... I like his game.

The defense as it stands is un-acceptable, they must address that asap in my opinion. They are so full of holes its scary to think about.

Bottom line , Wings are a mess and will be for a season or so unless they spend money.

I like Tatar. I don't think they should move him just yet. Nyquist is to inconsistent and teletubby flat out aint got no luck at all and that's to bad for a guy with his size. They ought to park him in front of the net more often alla Holmstrom.

Whats your take on Blashill? I personally don't think he can cut it. Hope I'm wrong.

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Re: Detroit Red Wings

I'm not sure about Blashill.   I don't have a strong opinion.   I don't think he has enough authority to be given credit or assigned blame for much.   He was coaching to win all year, based on ice time and deployment (as most coaches should coach), I don't think he was ordered to develop anybody and he doesn't have the pull to make that call himself in my opinion.

I always liked Nyquist for example but I never thought he was first line stuff, maybe like a Steen 2-way with first line complimentary stuff, but not a guy to carry everything. 

Larkin may be there, but he's looked terrible trying to carry a line this year, he still needs alot of protection.   I think he ends up on the wing and he's bad at faceoffs so far.   That could improve though, I think fewer and fewer coaches worry about centers or wings taking draws anyway.    I think it would be several years before they are first line types from within.   Mantha is the only one I could see as top line stuff, but he's a project too.   

AA reminds me of too many other prospects and he's only getting 13+ minutes a game, that's a bottom six workload for a team struggling offensively.    I don't think Blashill would hold him back so much if the ceiling was that high.    I weigh TOI heavily in when gauging a young players' ceiling, either a coach or GM will push TOI if they really like them long term imo.    I think AA is a nice player, but I'm not sure he's as good as some of his individual attributes may project him to be.    My opinion may change on him if he puts on another 10-15lbs without losing much in the way of skating.

"I'm not god, I'm not a doctor.  I'm closer to a veterinarian than a doctor"- Darryl Sutter

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3,927

Re: Detroit Red Wings

Tatar is due a big raise.   I don't think he's going to be there when the team turns around and he's clogging up TOI Mantha, Teletubby, and AA may be getting (even though Tatar is a LW, and not all of them can go to that side effectively). 

I say trade him now.  They have time and they have to unravel what's a real good talent and what is just depth.   Tatar is going to get in the way of that imo.    I really thought Chicago  was going to go after him since they needed a better offensive LW.

"I'm not god, I'm not a doctor.  I'm closer to a veterinarian than a doctor"- Darryl Sutter

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Re: Detroit Red Wings

hockeybob wrote:

Tatar is due a big raise.   I don't think he's going to be there when the team turns around and he's clogging up TOI Mantha, Teletubby, and AA may be getting (even though Tatar is a LW, and not all of them can go to that side effectively). 

I say trade him now.  They have time and they have to unravel what's a real good talent and what is just depth.   Tatar is going to get in the way of that imo.    I really thought Chicago  was going to go after him since they needed a better offensive LW.


I understand the logic, sort of, but Tatar has been the best thing that's improved on the offensive side for the Wings. If it wasn't for Tatar and Zetterberg's play the Wings will be competing with the Avalanche, lol.

I like Tatar as a keeper, I think he has a bright future and still the ability to improve, but it will cost the Wings some cash.

I wonder if Franz Nielsen is someone who could be moved. He's kinda let me down as far as offensive production goes. Good player, I just expected a little more I guess.

I still think the Red Wings have a decent team, they just arnt plugged into the right places yet. They really need some more 2-way players that can cover 200' of ice without having to think to much.

Its a mess that hurts my head. I think the voices that I have are reproducing and I may be rapidly reaching Hockeybob status as far as their concerned. The noise in my head is deafening.
_____________________

... and then there's the defense. :(

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3,929

Re: Detroit Red Wings

I like Tatar as a keeper, I think he has a bright future and still the ability to improve

I think his game is one that settles into a one dimensional type as a Vrbata, he's not going durable enough to handle a top line workload imo.   He's getting significantly more TOI, but the production hasn't increased with it (shot or standard).   Some of that is because of the QoT and QoC (linemates and competition quality), but much of it is because he has an established ceiling imo.

He's 26 now, so he is in his prime this year and next year.   Maybe he maintains the performance several years from now but I'm skeptical.    I like Tatar, I just don't think he'll be cost effective when the wings are ready to turn things around.   It's kind of like the same logic I use for trading Simmonds.    Limited skill sets that can't play on a top line are not core player types and they should be managed from a strictly value perspective.   I just don't hink he'll be worth as much in the future as he is now.    Since the Wings are on track to struggle for at least the next couple of years (probably more), I think it's best to cash him in while he still net a large return. 

That blueline is a problem, and that's part of the reason I think a tear down and rebuild will take so much time.

"I'm not god, I'm not a doctor.  I'm closer to a veterinarian than a doctor"- Darryl Sutter

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Re: Detroit Red Wings

. I think the voices that I have are reproducing

I'm sorry.   When they tell you to do the bad things, try your best.

I still think the Red Wings have a decent team

They do, the problem is that there is little they can do to offset the degrading performances relative to the cap hits imo.      Toronto, Buffalo, and FLA aren't going to be worse next year and that means Kenny still has to hop Boston, MTL, and OTT.   

It's not all about what Detroit is or isn't, it's also about how they compare to everybody else in the division.      They don't have a number 1 fwd, a number 1 dman or a number 1 goalie established yet.     I think it's really tough to slot a roster without 2 of those while expecting to make the playoffs.    EDM is the only team that I can think of that doesn't have 2 of those 3 spots covered.

"I'm not god, I'm not a doctor.  I'm closer to a veterinarian than a doctor"- Darryl Sutter

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